Topic: Buying an Already-raced Lemons car

There's plenty of cars on Craigslist that claim to have been Lemons raced already, but they (obviously) cost more than $500.

My Question: Is it acceptable to purchase an already-prepped race car? Why or why not?

Let's say the car costs $2000. Can I say I'm really buying a $500 car, but that it includes $1500 worth of safety equipment?

Re: Buying an Already-raced Lemons car

Yes

LemonAid - Changing kids lives one lap at a time.

3 (edited by TheEngineer 2016-11-01 09:24 AM)

Re: Buying an Already-raced Lemons car

totally common practice. You can go through the motions of writing the bill of sale for "$500 for car and $1500 for safety gear", or just not worry about it. If it's been run a few times they judges will recognize it.

Edit: make sure the car has actually been run however. I've seen some listings where the wording is more "could be run in Lemons" and it has some janky cage that wouldn't pass tech in a million years.

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Re: Buying an Already-raced Lemons car

OK great. I'm pretty sure I've read every FAQ and newby-oriented page on this site, and I didn't see where that was addressed anywhere.

Thanks!

Re: Buying an Already-raced Lemons car

Technically no, according to rule 4.1.1, but people do it all the time and they don't rake them over the coals for it. I'd do it that way if I had any sense; I've built my last two from street cars and it is slower, more painful, and more expensive to do all the work yourself.

Everybody grab your brooms, it's shenanigans!

Re: Buying an Already-raced Lemons car

rmcdaniels wrote:

Technically no, according to rule 4.1.1, but people do it all the time and they don't rake them over the coals for it. I'd do it that way if I had any sense; I've built my last two from street cars and it is slower, more painful, and more expensive to do all the work yourself.


Lemons HQ doesn't even care enough to read the rules that way. As evidenced by them advertising the super snipe sale with:
"How about a turnkey, LeMons-legal, IOE-winning, street-registered Humber Super Snipe wagon, now a mere $99 for the car and $1700 for the safety equipment? That's cheaper than a lot of roll cages."

20+ Time Loser FutilityMotorsport
Abandoned E36 Build
2008 Saab 9-5Aero Wagon
Retired - 1989 Dodge Daytona Shelby 2011-2015 "Lifetime Award for Lack of Achievement" IOE, 3X I got screwed, Organizer's Choice

Re: Buying an Already-raced Lemons car

Yes, that's what I said, it's technically against the rules but they don't enforce that rule. I thought that it was important to include that because this is the Newcomers forum and if anyone actually read the rules, then they'd see that what the OP is asking about is actually against the rules.

Everybody grab your brooms, it's shenanigans!

Re: Buying an Already-raced Lemons car

Be sure to find out when was the last time they race in Lemons.  There are some cars that sit around for years before the owners realize they won't be able to go back racing anytime soon.  Some of these have fallen very behind on the safety updates and it may need to have all their gear ripped out and replaced which would make your cost much higher than if you started with a street car.

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9 (edited by mully006 2016-11-01 01:30 PM)

Re: Buying an Already-raced Lemons car

Having bought prepared cars twice now, it is not a big deal at all.  I always write a show bill of sale for $500 and then a real one for the actual amount.  Actually at NHMS the BS judges saw the real bill of sale and I just told them that it was $500 for the car and $2500 for the safety equipment.  If the car has been run before then you will not have a problem. 

The way that I read rule 4.1.1 is that it is for instances where people are buying cars that were raced in other series and trying to pass a $4k car though tech saying it has a $3500 cage in it. 

You can also write up the bill of sale for $500 for the car and then the balance for the belts, the seat, the fuel cell, and spares or whatever.

EDIT

+1 for making sure it has been raced recently.  The rules do change year to year and a car that raced 4 years ago is no longer legal.  I always bring a printed version of the tech sheet and to a tech inspection myself before I buy it.

Moot Point Racing - 1991 Volvo 240 - #496

10 (edited by therood 2016-11-01 04:11 PM)

Re: Buying an Already-raced Lemons car

Want to be safe? Email Judge Phil (judgephil@24hoursoflemons.com) and say: "I just bought this car. Can I get a residual value?"

For the most part, as long as you haven't made a ridiculous upgrade to the car since it was last raced, you won't get crap. But if, for example, you buy a V6 third-gen Camaro with a blown engine and you show up with a Vortec 5.3-liter, you're going to get a sideways eye.

EDIT: Also, bring a printed copy of the email and as much documentation as you can, just to be safe.

Eric Rood
Everything Bagel, 24 Hours of Lemons
eric@24hoursoflemons.com

11 (edited by fleming95 2016-11-01 04:21 PM)

Re: Buying an Already-raced Lemons car

therood wrote:

Want to be safe? Email Judge Phil (judgephil@24hoursoflemons.com) and say: "I just bought this car. Can I get a residual value?"

For the most part, as long as you haven't made a ridiculous upgrade to the car since it was last raced, you won't get crap. But if, for example, you buy a V6 third-gen Camaro with a blown engine and you make a ridiculous downgrade to an Iron Duke, you're possibly going to get a hug.

Re: Buying an Already-raced Lemons car

therood wrote:

Want to be safe? Email Judge Phil (judgephil@24hoursoflemons.com) and say: "I just bought this car. Can I get a residual value?"

For the most part, as long as you haven't made a ridiculous upgrade to the car since it was last raced, you won't get crap. But if, for example, you buy a V6 third-gen Camaro with a blown engine and you show up with a Vortec 5.3-liter, you're going to get a sideways eye.

EDIT: Also, bring a printed copy of the email and as much documentation as you can, just to be safe.


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