251 (edited by Marc 2011-02-24 04:08 AM)

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

Judge Phil wrote:

Will there be room for the heads?

the bottom left head is installed, you can barely see it peeking below the muffler shroud. it is missing the valve cover still, but that's only about 1.3" tall

you can kinda see it's position in this closer picture:
http://frankensteinmotorworks.com/AirplaneMR2/IMG_0049.jpg

or in this slightly blury picture:
http://frankensteinmotorworks.com/AirplaneMR2/IMG_0056.jpg

Spank wrote:

when you're done with the mid engine setup, let me know how I can help you move it to this:

http://fastcache.gawkerassets.com/asset … i_haha.jpg

making a plastic model of the MR2 or moving the whole setup to a mini?

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

Rockford Brodie wrote:

I'm surprised this hasn't been moved to Epic Builds...it's already an epic thread.

So true.  It's one of the theads I look forward to seeing every day.  This truely is epic and needs the recognition.

El Capitan de Substandard Racing -  Houston, Tx
2009 Yee Haw! It's Lemons Texas: 1973 Gremlin - Gremwow!
2010 Gator-O-Rama: 1973 Gremlin - Gremlin Express, Lassiez le Crapheaps Roulette - Gremlin - Most Heroic Fix
http://substandardracing.blogspot.com/

253

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

I don't mind if the thread gets moved, but I don't think it would change the audience much.

on related "epic" news, my wife got me a leather aviator cap and a white scarf.

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

Not to be a debbie-downer, but how are you gonna NOT bottom out when suspension is under full compression?

LemonAid - Changing kids lives one lap at a time.

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

TeamLemon-aid wrote:

Not to be a debbie-downer, but how are you gonna NOT bottom out when suspension is under full compression?

Don't take it off any jumps?

You are only entitled to the space you occupy.

256

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

TeamLemon-aid wrote:

Not to be a debbie-downer, but how are you gonna NOT bottom out when suspension is under full compression?

there's a little over 3" under there. the shocks can only move about 3.5" before they reach full stuff. i doubt I'll ever hit full stuff on both sides at the same time.

my road going MR2 only has 4.5" clearance under the same area and i never hit anything. a road course is significantly smoother than a road around here.

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

Not sure about anyone else, but many cars are on the bump stops routinely during a race.  If you have more suspension travel than ground clearance you may have an issue.  I don't claim to be a suspension/chassis expert, so certainly I will defer to those that are.

I'm just saying... Once you get this thing all put together and running, you need to get it on a track and see if it's an issue.  Your build is incredible, but I'd hate to see you come to a grinding halt on that first hard corner you take. 

It would suck to have to baby it constantly for fear of grinding your beautiful work.

LemonAid - Changing kids lives one lap at a time.

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

Maybe just get taller bump stops?

Quad4 CRX - Wartburg 311 - Civic Wagovan - Parnelli Jones Galaxie - LS400 - Lancia MR2 - Boat - Sentra - 56 Ford Victoria
Known Associate of 3pedal Mafia, Speedycop, and the Russians.  Maybe even NSF.

259

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

in the past we've hit the stops a lot on our other cars. but only ever one side at a time. the low point is pretty much centered under the car.

I'll try to get better pictures to show the clearance with a tape measure under there, but tonight isn't looking good since we're getting almost a foot of snow here today.

my plan for tonight is to make CV shafts. as long as i don't get snowed in.

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

Simplest solution:  Skid plate.

Silent But Deadly Racing-  Ricky Bobby's Laughing Clown Malt Liquor Thunderbird , Datsun 510, 87 Mustang (The Race Team Formerly Known as Prince), 72 Pinto Squire waggy, Parnelli Jones 67 Galaxie, Turbo Coupe Surf wagon.(The Surfin Bird), Squatting Dogs In Tracksuits,  Space Pants!  Roy Fuckin Kent and The tribute to a tribute to a tribute THUNDERBIRD/ SUNDAHBADOH!

261

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

Alright guys, the fact that the engine hasn't run in 66 years is a much bigger problem than a few sparks here and there occasionally. I'm going to focus on solving the problems that are definitely problems first.

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

If things are kept the same and you do put a skid plate on, and you do scrape once in a while, can you run a night race so we can get picks of the rooster tail of sparks?  smile

LemonAid - Changing kids lives one lap at a time.

263

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

Marc wrote:

Alright guys, the fact that the engine hasn't run in 66 years is a much bigger problem than a few sparks here and there occasionally. I'm going to focus on solving the problems that are definitely problems first.

I admire your optomistic 'build it all and hope it run afterwards' approach man.  For me, I can't see putting in all that time and effort to end up with yes it fits, and yes it would all work, but sadly the engine doesn't run.

Captain
Team Super Westerfield Bros.
'93 Acura Integra - No VTEC Yo!

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

Just a thought: if you can get an R6 or an R1 throttle body set, I have extra TB's (less than five, unfortunately) of both, and I can build you a Megasquirt to FI it all. R1 can easily make over 200hp on stock injectors, so you'd be covered at least up to 250hp, and injector selection is there if you want more. Allows you to use the stock tank, pump, and return system as-is, too.

Adding a turbo (or five) would be a breeze from there on, at least in terms of fueling the thing.

How's ignition, by the way?

K Car Stalker

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

VKZ24 wrote:

I admire your optomistic 'build it all and hope it run afterwards' approach man.  For me, I can't see putting in all that time and effort to end up with yes it fits, and yes it would all work, but sadly the engine doesn't run.

Realistically, it's up to him as to whether it runs at this point!  He has cylinders and valves with compression, so he just needs to work out fuel and spark.  Making a "running" motor test stand would be most of the work of actually putting it in the car and would be useless once he proves it's running.

But yeah, he's a lot more optimistic than most, and that's great!

Quad4 CRX - Wartburg 311 - Civic Wagovan - Parnelli Jones Galaxie - LS400 - Lancia MR2 - Boat - Sentra - 56 Ford Victoria
Known Associate of 3pedal Mafia, Speedycop, and the Russians.  Maybe even NSF.

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

I'm optimistic he'll get the engine running.  So I was pointing out something that he probably had already spent countless hours thinking about. 

I'm pretty useless in that way.

We're here to cheer ya' on man!

LemonAid - Changing kids lives one lap at a time.

267

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

I believe marc mentioned early on he's dumping the magneto stuff for a real EFI setup as he apparently does engine computer software. He makes me wanna sneak the buick out to him for a reprogram. wink

it would not surprise me if we see some kinda shadetree megasquirt variant that cost him half as much to build as buying the right stuff in the first place. I'm -VERY- geeked about seeing this bad boy run!

268

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

the plan right now is swinging towards EFI, I haven't thought much about 5 throttle bodies versus 1 and how to mount the injectors. if you have those motorcycle throttle bodies with fuel injector mounts already on them, it would be fantastic! i sent you an e-mail.

i would love to do a shady EFI, but i may be running out of time and just have to do a vanilla megasquirt.

one thing i need to figure out is if i can use a waste spark coil to actuate both plugs in a single cylinder. i think there's no reason it would not work, but i'm not 100% sure. normally one plug has a lower breakdown voltage because it has a compressed air charge in it. maybe i can use a different gap on both plugs to start the flame front in a predictable manner each time. using a 4 cylinder and 6 cylinder Ford EDIS module would be much cheaper than 10 individual coils.

as for the "it doesn't run yet" comment. i have opened the motor and fully dissembled, fixed and resembled it. i know the motor is good, the cylinders have low~ish leak-down numbers. certainly enough to get good compression. fuel and spark will be fully custom since i'm not using the stock provisions so we aren't talking about a high risk that may or may not show up. i *know* that i need to make these custom things.

the only hard part in this whole equation is the insane timeline.

269

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

maybe cannibalize the EFI from a v10 ford superduty or v10 dodge ram? you basically could just play "match the 2 sparks for each cylinder" game. probably another hodge-podge way would be getting the system off an I5 audi...or maybe 2 of them? (this is starting to remind me of speedycop's BMW V12 in the T-bird)

270

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

Serj wrote:

maybe cannibalize the EFI from a v10 ford superduty or v10 dodge ram? you basically could just play "match the 2 sparks for each cylinder" game. probably another hodge-podge way would be getting the system off an I5 audi...or maybe 2 of them? (this is starting to remind me of speedycop's BMW V12 in the T-bird)

i already have two audi I5 vacuum/mechanical advanced distributors that i was going to use with the original carburetor setup.

yeah, it's definitely got a lemon flavour to this project smile

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

I'm awestruck.... This is an epic build, and I get to see it! As I'll be managing the race he is aiming for.... Sweet!

Gosh, my business card says 'Tech Tyrant'

272 (edited by Marc 2011-02-24 02:36 PM)

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

before starting work on the car tonight i figured i'd get a few daytime pics:

sorry i did not pull it out entirely, it became apparent after a few feet of movement that the rear toe isn't as perfect as i'd like it to be. any further and the ice would have prevented me from pushing it back in the shop.

http://frankensteinmotorworks.com/AirplaneMR2/IMG_0062.jpg

and here's one with a scale of the clearance. the piece of wood on the ground is a 4x4 post and it *almost* fits under the crossmember

http://frankensteinmotorworks.com/AirplaneMR2/IMG_0064.jpg

off to the shop i go for now!

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

Put the engine cover back on and you can pull it off as a big rear diff and a velocity stack!

The Homer: Powerful like a gorilla, yet soft and yielding like a Nerf ball.

274

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

how about another update. i've got half-shafts!

i even documented the whole thing because i figured someone would ask how i made them.

1) cut shaft to right length
http://frankensteinmotorworks.com/AirplaneMR2/IMG_0065.jpg

2) machine a taper on the edge and a centered hole for a dowel pin, 10thou under or so.
http://frankensteinmotorworks.com/AirplaneMR2/IMG_0066.jpg

3) use a shit-ton of pressure to smash it all together
http://frankensteinmotorworks.com/AirplaneMR2/IMG_0067.jpg
http://frankensteinmotorworks.com/AirplaneMR2/IMG_0069.jpg

4) admire the new shafts
http://frankensteinmotorworks.com/AirplaneMR2/IMG_0070.jpg

5) setup the shaft in the rotary welder and pre-heat the shaft a bit
http://frankensteinmotorworks.com/AirplaneMR2/IMG_0071.jpg

6) weld the first pass
http://frankensteinmotorworks.com/AirplaneMR2/IMG_0072.jpg

7) using the press and an indicator, straighten shaft
http://frankensteinmotorworks.com/AirplaneMR2/IMG_0073.jpg

8) finish welding and sand-blast the weld to clean it up a bit
http://frankensteinmotorworks.com/AirplaneMR2/IMG_0077.jpg

9)put together the chinese frustration puzzle
http://frankensteinmotorworks.com/AirplaneMR2/IMG_0078.jpg

10) tada!
http://frankensteinmotorworks.com/AirplaneMR2/IMG_0079.jpg

and then, if the math was right, it even all fits!

http://frankensteinmotorworks.com/AirplaneMR2/IMG_0080.jpg
http://frankensteinmotorworks.com/AirplaneMR2/IMG_0081.jpg
http://frankensteinmotorworks.com/AirplaneMR2/IMG_0083.jpg

i still need to place about a dozen fasteners to hold everything in place, but the half-shafts are done.

Re: Never before has so little power been made from so much displacement!

Marc wrote:

how about another update. i've got half-shafts!
i even documented the whole thing because i figured someone would ask how i made them.

Beautiful job!   Thanks for the photos.

"I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it!"
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"Every Super Snipe in Lemons has won an IOE!"