Topic: Ground Welds ? Will they fail tech?

We installed our base plates for the roll bar.  A lot of welding and some burn through.  Fixed all holes with re-welded or added small plates.

After welding, all welds were ground flush with the 1/8" plate.

I was advised that this may not pass tech inspection.

Any accurate information on status of ground welds on baseplates. 

We are at the point of welding the roll cage and if what we have now is not acceptable as a starting point I do not want to weld the roll cage to them.

Thanks from Team Twin Screw

Re: Ground Welds ? Will they fail tech?

In general the inspectors do not like ground welds.  Pictures would help, but your best best is to email HQ with pictures and ask them directly.

Team Glue Sticks
00 Firebird, 02 X-Type, 93 NX2000, 00 Mazda 626 (Sold)
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Re: Ground Welds ? Will they fail tech?

To an inspector, weld grinding = hiding something.

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Re: Ground Welds ? Will they fail tech?

Thanks,  I would have posted pictures but needed the requisite TWO posts before doing so.

Re: Ground Welds ? Will they fail tech?

My experience, but my no means expertise, has taught me that ground welds on spreader plates doesn't seem to be a big deal. The reason you cite makes sense.

Ground welds on the cage tubing joints is most definitely problematic and should be strictly avoided unless it's for removal and fully re-welding a previously Whoopsie Weld.

Re: Ground Welds ? Will they fail tech?

Spank wrote:

My experience, but my no means expertise, has taught me that ground welds on spreader plates doesn't seem to be a big deal. The reason you cite makes sense.

Ground welds on the cage tubing joints is most definitely problematic and should be strictly avoided unless it's for removal and fully re-welding a previously Whoopsie Weld.


X2

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Re: Ground Welds ? Will they fail tech?

I'm guessing this is the same car that I saw a FB post in regards to.  It appears cage building is mostly an exercise in planning out order of operations so you don't paint yourself into a corner.  While it may seem logical to build from the bottom up, the plates typically get welded in last, not first.  Getting 360 welds on the top of the cage without lowering the cage or cutting access holes in the roof may prove to be difficult.  Unless those plates are intended to be the base plates for plinth boxes, you may already be boxing yourself in.

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Re: Ground Welds ? Will they fail tech?

cheseroo wrote:

I'm guessing this is the same car that I saw a FB post in regards to.  It appears cage building is mostly an exercise in planning out order of operations so you don't paint yourself into a corner.  While it may seem logical to build from the bottom up, the plates typically get welded in last, not first.  Getting 360 welds on the top of the cage without lowering the cage or cutting access holes in the roof may prove to be difficult.  Unless those plates are intended to be the base plates for plinth boxes, you may already be boxing yourself in.

THey may be cutting holes in their roof in the near future.

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Re: Ground Welds ? Will they fail tech?

FWIW I'll have my sawzall and arm restraints at the track Friday, so we can cut the whole roof off and fix everything they've failed you on. Remember, convertible means classy, and the roof means extra pounds!

Seriously, no matter what, bring the car to the track. Worst case, we'll drag it to my shop in Baltimore and weld all evening. I think I have enough banned cars' cages by now to fix almost anything.

K Car Stalker

Re: Ground Welds ? Will they fail tech?

If you do get stuck I plan on having my mig there and some extra tube too.

Team Glue Sticks
00 Firebird, 02 X-Type, 93 NX2000, 00 Mazda 626 (Sold)
2016 NJMP Heroic Fix, 2017 NJMP Near Heroic Fix except we can't drive, 2017 Thompson I Got Screwed

Re: Ground Welds ? Will they fail tech?

Thanks for all the input.  We need to start from scratch and have come to the  realization that we wont race this coming weekend.

this is our first Lemons and will have to chock this up to trying to get too much done in too little time.  We did not start until we got the notice we are in . 

There are still a few other things we need to do as well.  if it is not raining tomorrow we will take a crack at grinding some of what is there out and cutting hole to drop the uprights down as suggested

If a miracle happens and we make MAJOR progress we may be there but does not look probable at this point.

Re: Ground Welds ? Will they fail tech?

Come anyway.  Usually there are enough people who have their shit together that can help you get it closer.  You may even make it out Sunday and get heroic fix...

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Re: Ground Welds ? Will they fail tech?

You can build an entire car in a night, if you have 4-6 people. Come, we'll get you through tech by Saturday morning. Post here by Wednesday as to where you're at and what tools you'll bring so we know what to expect/bring.

Your fees are already in the drain so might as well dive in after 'em.

K Car Stalker

Re: Ground Welds ? Will they fail tech?

firegremlin wrote:

You can build an entire car in a night, if you have 4-6 people. Come, we'll get you through tech by Saturday morning. Post here by Wednesday as to where you're at and what tools you'll bring so we know what to expect/bring.

Your fees are already in the drain so might as well dive in after 'em.

This. The money's already spent. Unless you have to tow 1000 miles, you don't have much to lose.

Also, I guarantee you will have more fun thrashing on the car all weekend and running for an hour on Sunday afternoon than you will if you stay home. Just don't hesitate to ask for help. Might be a good idea to set your paddock space up in a well-traveled area so more bystanders are aware of your plight and can lend a hand/tool/part/beer.

Command Pilot/Flight Director, Escape Velocity Racing
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Re: Ground Welds ? Will they fail tech?

What they all said, bring it. Show up Thursday and get a good spot. Tons of people that are willing to help.


Let us know what you need so we can get you on track.

14 Time Loser FutilityMotorsport
2008 Saab 9-5Aero Wagon
Retired - 1989 Dodge Daytona Shelby 2011-2015 "Lifetime Award for Lack of Achievement" IOE, 3X I got screwed, Organizer's Choice

Re: Ground Welds ? Will they fail tech?

^^^^^^^^^^
What they've all said.

Seriously, there is no better place to get your hooptie done then surrounded by 2,000 morons that have been where you are right now.

Consider this race weekend a good shakedown event and you'll be all set for the next race by end of Sunday.  And while you may or may not take the Green on Sat morning, you will get laps before the checker falls on Sunday.

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Re: Ground Welds ? Will they fail tech?

Posting only to say this thread is a perfect example of why Lemons is so special.  I challenge anyone to identify another competitive organization for anything, anywhere, where dozens of people are willing to donate tools and equipment and stay up all night long if necessary to help a competitor.  It's really incredible and I'm proud to finally be a part of it.

Electric Mayhem Racing

Re: Ground Welds ? Will they fail tech?

We always carry three things that we (mostly) will never need:

3-4' of cage tube
spare universal "Windshield"
Engine hoist

With the minivan, we do not even use the hoist for subframe swaps.  Last race three engines...two from the same team.  most races, at least two.

The cage tube has been used by three teams.

The welded wire mesh, twice.