Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

darkostoj wrote:

I thought about that. I'm really lucky because I own a salvage yard and have multiples of all the viper parts in stock. Its like destiny is making this car happen.

Unless you plan on bringing the salvage yard with you to the race that doesn't always help. Don't get me wrong, I would love to see it on the track. Just trying to throw out potential pitfalls. We've been doing this a long time.

1992 Saturn SL2 (retired) - Elmo's Revenge -  Class B winner, Heroic Fix winner x2
1969 Rover P6B 3500S(sold) - Super G-Rover - I.O.E Winner, Class C Winner
1996 Saturn SW2 - Elmo's Revenge (reborn!), Saturn SL1  Dazzleshipm Class C x2 and IOE winner
1974 AMC Javelin - Oscar's Trash heap - IOE,”Organizer's Choice" and "I got Screwed" award winner

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

darkostoj wrote:

I was planning on doing a solid rear axle and 3 link, but I was also debating on keeping the rear suspension stock.  That way there is something crappy still on the car.

Just be careful where you skimp. That engine is a monster and if you really lighten up the car, it could easily become a handful.

1992 Saturn SL2 (retired) - Elmo's Revenge -  Class B winner, Heroic Fix winner x2
1969 Rover P6B 3500S(sold) - Super G-Rover - I.O.E Winner, Class C Winner
1996 Saturn SW2 - Elmo's Revenge (reborn!), Saturn SL1  Dazzleshipm Class C x2 and IOE winner
1974 AMC Javelin - Oscar's Trash heap - IOE,”Organizer's Choice" and "I got Screwed" award winner

78 (edited by darkostoj 2018-08-01 04:49 PM)

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

chaase wrote:
darkostoj wrote:

I was planning on doing a solid rear axle and 3 link, but I was also debating on keeping the rear suspension stock.  That way there is something crappy still on the car.

Just be careful where you skimp. That engine is a monster and if you really lighten up the car, it could easily become a handful.

The rear suspension is pretty much bulletproof other than the axleshafts that slide into the wheel bearing.  It uses a single woodruff key and that really scares me.  I would have to pull it out and have it machined for probably a total of 4 per wheel.

I could weld the rear diff.  Do track cars generally run best with a spool, or a LSD/Locker that unlocks/slips at turns?

2018 Where the Elite Meet to Cheat - Organizer's Choice Award
2019 Rust Belt GP - Spirit of Entropy Award
2019 The Tony Swan Never-Say-Die Memorial - Index of Effluency Award
2020 The Tony Swan Never-Say-Die Memorial - Class C Lap Winner

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

darkostoj wrote:
chaase wrote:
darkostoj wrote:

I was planning on doing a solid rear axle and 3 link, but I was also debating on keeping the rear suspension stock.  That way there is something crappy still on the car.

Just be careful where you skimp. That engine is a monster and if you really lighten up the car, it could easily become a handful.

The rear suspension is pretty much bulletproof other than the axleshafts that slide into the wheel bearing.  It uses a single woodruff key and that really scares me.  I would have to pull it out and have it machined for probably a total of 4 per wheel.

I could weld the rear diff.  Do track cars generally run best with a spool, or a LSD/Locker that unlocks/slips at turns?

I would go with an LSD but that's me.

1992 Saturn SL2 (retired) - Elmo's Revenge -  Class B winner, Heroic Fix winner x2
1969 Rover P6B 3500S(sold) - Super G-Rover - I.O.E Winner, Class C Winner
1996 Saturn SW2 - Elmo's Revenge (reborn!), Saturn SL1  Dazzleshipm Class C x2 and IOE winner
1974 AMC Javelin - Oscar's Trash heap - IOE,”Organizer's Choice" and "I got Screwed" award winner

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

darkostoj wrote:

So how many penalty laps you guys thing I'm getting??? neutral

I wonder if they will leave me alone if the car has tiger paws lol

Midwest race...C0

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

Use a roller 305...I can tell you how to make well over 320hp with a POS engine. no points...

"get up and get your grandma outta here"

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

Spank wrote:

Build what you want. Race what you want. Expect that you may possibly get penalty laps from time to time to satisfy whiners (like me) and to throw up some semblance that they DO care. But, really, build and bring whatever you want. When a Yugo finishes higher than you in the standings it'll make good wrapup video fodder.

This.  Lemons is all about having fun, and even with a Viper drivetrain, you aren't likely to come even close to winning.  Build it, and come have fun.

Captain
Team Super Westerfield Bros.
'93 Acura Integra - No VTEC Yo!

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

Owning a salvage yard doesn't make parts free, that's spelled out in the rules. Parts you have lying around are assigned a real world value.

I agree with the build what you want mentality. But it's more fun for everyone if you at least pretend to care about the spirit of the series. Bringing an old rolls? awesome. Trying to simplify the rolls and make it somewhat track capable so it's less of a rolling road block? Still good, and appreciated by everyone who is faster. Flexing and putting in a $10k+ drivetrain just because you have it there? Kinda pushing it.

If it were me, I'd leave the Rolls engine. I'd find a way to slap a manual on it, boost it, and run that till it breaks. From what I've heard that engine is not super fragile, and thanks to it's low compression it takes boost well. Run it like that and then when/if it goes boom swap in the LS.

20+ Time Loser FutilityMotorsport
Abandoned E36 Build
2008 Saab 9-5Aero Wagon
Retired - 1989 Dodge Daytona Shelby 2011-2015 "Lifetime Award for Lack of Achievement" IOE, 3X I got screwed, Organizer's Choice

84 (edited by darkostoj 2018-08-02 06:23 AM)

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

TheEngineer wrote:

Owning a salvage yard doesn't make parts free, that's spelled out in the rules. Parts you have lying around are assigned a real world value.

I agree with the build what you want mentality. But it's more fun for everyone if you at least pretend to care about the spirit of the series. Bringing an old rolls? awesome. Trying to simplify the rolls and make it somewhat track capable so it's less of a rolling road block? Still good, and appreciated by everyone who is faster. Flexing and putting in a $10k+ drivetrain just because you have it there? Kinda pushing it.

If it were me, I'd leave the Rolls engine. I'd find a way to slap a manual on it, boost it, and run that till it breaks. From what I've heard that engine is not super fragile, and thanks to it's low compression it takes boost well. Run it like that and then when/if it goes boom swap in the LS.

I really spent time to figure out how to use that RR engine, because honestly that thing is badass.  It is aluminum block and aluminum head, 20 head studs per bank, gear driven cam, all forged, etc.  The problem is that the factory runs an adapter bellhousing flange that pushed the trans back 2", and it has adapter spaces on the crank that push the flexplate back 2" as well.  That adapter bellhousing converts the RR bolt pattern to a BOP pattern and mates to a BOP turbo 400.  Any way I looked at it converting that engine to run a manual was going to be big $$$$ and a lot of time making it work.

I decided to do an engine transplant because I'm doing this for fun, and not trying to be a show-off or flex different expensive parts we have here. A Viper powered vintage rolls royce just sounded really awesome big_smile I was a driver on my friends team a couple months ago and had such a great time I wanted to do it again with a car I built.  Even though the car is going to have a lot of good parts in it, I don't think I have a chance in hell of winning anyway...and I don't think that's what its about either.  I plan on just having fun, taking whatever penalty laps they give, and spend a weekend racing a fun car that I built that I really like.  I thought about building a car that would be competitive in the race, but it sounds so much for fun to me having a crazy build.  I guess thats up to the judges to decide what they want to do with the car and how they want it in their race.

2018 Where the Elite Meet to Cheat - Organizer's Choice Award
2019 Rust Belt GP - Spirit of Entropy Award
2019 The Tony Swan Never-Say-Die Memorial - Index of Effluency Award
2020 The Tony Swan Never-Say-Die Memorial - Class C Lap Winner

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

I suppose what may be somewhat a parallel to this is the caddy powered Miata.  What seemed like a bad idea actually worked out to be rocket fast.  And if I end up getting beat by a V10 Rolls, well, I expect my reaction will be to laugh.

1990 RX7 "Mazdarita"  1964 Sunbeam Imp (IOE 2013 Sears Pointless) 2002 Jaguar x-type (Winner C-Class 2021 Sears Pointless)
Gone bye-bye
1994 Jaguar XJ12 (Winner C-Class 2013 Sears Pointless)  1980 Rover SD1 (I Got Screwed 2014 Return of Lemonites)

86 (edited by Team Infinniti 2018-08-02 08:47 AM)

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

Rolls Guy wrote:

  The problem is that the factory runs an adapter bellhousing flange that pushed the trans back 2", and it has adapter spaces on the crank that push the flexplate back 2" as well.  That adapter bellhousing converts the RR bolt pattern to a BOP pattern and mates to a BOP turbo 400.  Any way I looked at it converting that engine to run a manual was going to be big $$$$ and a lot of time making it work.

The only problem is believing a manual trans is mandatory, as you know, the th400 is plenty robust, so much so rolls frigging royce adopted it for lack of a better answer!

A little history on team Infinniti, we run a 95 Infiniti j30, for the first 5-6 years it was totally stock, jatco slushbox and all, sure we broke the trans a few times in 28 races but wound up on the podium more then not, now we have a q45 driveline, broke one engine but never the matching  jatco 4 speed slushbox, still show up on the podium with it 35+ races into this madness.

Saying all that

A viper/camaro/rolls hybrid?!?  Doing it because it has never been done? Go for it! (but keep the rolls driveline, viper brakes/suspension?)

Watching this build carefully.

Homestead Chump 5th-Sebring 6th-PBIR Lemons 9th - Charlotte Chump  CrashnBurn 9th
Sebring 6th again -NOLA Chump 1st -PBIR Chump Trans Fail 16th
Daytona 11th - Sebring 6th - Atlanta Motor Speedway 2nd - Road Atlanta Trans Fail 61st-Road Atlanta 5th
Daytona 13th - Charlotte 9th - Sebring 2nd-Charlotte 25th broken brakes - Road Atlanta 14 10th-Daytona 14  58th- Humid TT 19th Judges' Choice!

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

Dude, this is going to be at Gingerman! Sweeet!

Also unless you’re a pro race shop, yea you won’t be getting sweat for a 3 month build with this kind of scope.

And when you finish this awsome build, start thinking of the stupidest car you can put that RR engine in.

Mistake By The Lake Racing (MBTL)
88 Thunderbird "THUNDERBIRDS ARE GO!", Ex Astris, Rubigo / Semper Fracti
A&D: 2014 Sebrings at Sebring (NSF), 2014 NJMP2 Jurassic Park (SpeedyCop), 2012 Summit Point J30 (PiNuts)
2018 Route Sucky-Suck Rally Miata, 2019 World Tour Of Texas 64 Newport

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

There are way too many party poopers in this thread.

Firstly - they're not going to take your car. Jay doesn't give a shit that Viper engines are $6k on ebay.

Secondly - you're not gonna get penalty laps. A fucking v10 powered Rolls Royce with a rear Camaro subframe and a manual gearbox? They literally wouldn't give a shit if you spent $20k.

Thirdly, DO IT!! I absolutely cannot wait to see this thing go around the track.

#33 Ford Festiva - We Are Not Really From Iran (Retired)
#928 Porsche 928 - West German Pushrodders (Retired)
#3 BMW E36 - The Internet says this is correct

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

This x1000: 

Fishah wrote:

There are way too many party poopers in this thread.

Firstly - they're not going to take your car. Jay doesn't give a shit that Viper engines are $6k on ebay.

Secondly - you're not gonna get penalty laps. A fucking v10 powered Rolls Royce with a rear Camaro subframe and a manual gearbox? They literally wouldn't give a shit if you spent $20k.

Thirdly, DO IT!! I absolutely cannot wait to see this thing go around the track.

Also this x1000: 

Cheesero wrote:

And if I end up getting beat by a V10 Rolls, well, I expect my reaction will be to laugh.

If you get beat by a Viper powered Rolls Royce and don't laugh you are likely racing in the wrong series.

10x loser (Arse-Freeze '11 - Vodden '15) 1x WINNER! Arse-Freeze '14 in the Watermelon Volvo Wagon
Swedish Knievel Skycycle('90 Volvo 740 Wagon)

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

As someone who recently got a V8 miata into class C with zero penalty laps, I'm excited to see how this build goes.  It would have to be the first semi-serious rolls royce track car, and definitely the only Viper powered Lemons car we'll ever see.

My guess is you will also likely be put in class C with zero laps since the likelihood of success is really quite low.  Slinging a 4000lb car around a track for 14 hours slowly is tough on components, even more so if you're running even close to a competitive pace.

Petrosexual Racing - 4.9 HT swap/Trashback Miata
https://forums.24hoursoflemons.com/view … p?id=35746
BFE GP '18 - 1st in C, High Plains Drifter -19 - 1st in B/Overall
Uh oh, Spaghettios...

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

Only nag I have is not seeing that rolls driveline in service, in this case, I could careless about class/points/laps/cost.

No matter how or what, it is going to be made out of pure awesome!

Homestead Chump 5th-Sebring 6th-PBIR Lemons 9th - Charlotte Chump  CrashnBurn 9th
Sebring 6th again -NOLA Chump 1st -PBIR Chump Trans Fail 16th
Daytona 11th - Sebring 6th - Atlanta Motor Speedway 2nd - Road Atlanta Trans Fail 61st-Road Atlanta 5th
Daytona 13th - Charlotte 9th - Sebring 2nd-Charlotte 25th broken brakes - Road Atlanta 14 10th-Daytona 14  58th- Humid TT 19th Judges' Choice!

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

I may have some issues with the viper engine oil pan. If I do I have to look into cutting it up to fit the subframe or maybe trying a SRT-10 truck oil pan but i think the sump may be too low in the chassis.

The manifolds basically turn straight out into the wheel, so either I need to cut and rotate that, try the SRT-10 Ram manifolds, or build custom headers.

Cut the mounts off the camaro subframe and getting ready to weld new ones on.

Viper donor car is all gutted.

https://i.imgur.com/JCUn0Vw.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/RFdEzzc.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/rLUtXrV.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/ZawCwOb.jpg

2018 Where the Elite Meet to Cheat - Organizer's Choice Award
2019 Rust Belt GP - Spirit of Entropy Award
2019 The Tony Swan Never-Say-Die Memorial - Index of Effluency Award
2020 The Tony Swan Never-Say-Die Memorial - Class C Lap Winner

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

You work quickly. I like you.

Where are you located? Do you have a target race in mind?

#33 Ford Festiva - We Are Not Really From Iran (Retired)
#928 Porsche 928 - West German Pushrodders (Retired)
#3 BMW E36 - The Internet says this is correct

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

Fishah wrote:

You work quickly. I like you.

Where are you located? Do you have a target race in mind?

In Detroit.

The car will be at the gingerman race in October.

Gives me a total of roughly 2 months from start to finish!

2018 Where the Elite Meet to Cheat - Organizer's Choice Award
2019 Rust Belt GP - Spirit of Entropy Award
2019 The Tony Swan Never-Say-Die Memorial - Index of Effluency Award
2020 The Tony Swan Never-Say-Die Memorial - Class C Lap Winner

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

TheEngineer wrote:

Owning a salvage yard doesn't make parts free, that's spelled out in the rules. Parts you have lying around are assigned a real world value.
.


Isn't it perfectly reasonable to buy parts cars, and sell what you need off them to get the parts you want at zero cost? I thought this was fairly common practice in Lemons accounting. I get free parts all the time doing this. My M50 swap was free after I sold shit off the parts car that I didn't need. That was for a street car build, but I don't see why that wouldn't fly in Lemons. I would think you could even get a viper engine for free doing that.

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

This is a must do! I love it.
Guys, if this one gets done it is instant IOE and won't get any penalty laps.
Its a ROLLS ROYCE for gods sake!
I rooting for you!!!!!.....
Manny

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

The viper v10 is totally and completely non-lemons-spirit as it isn't $500-my-ass, it is $5,000-my-ass.

I would at least go with a bmw v12, because that will certainly blow-up and is way more fun 'cheaty'  since its a BMW, whereas the viper motor is really good.

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

Good Lord!  Didn't this build just start on Sunday?  I grew up in a wrecking yard, and we had access to some shit, but you, good sir, are making hay. 

It sounds like full commitment on the Viper engine and RR chassis.  Which begs the following question.....

Who's gonna "borrow" the RR drivetrain and shoe-horn it into something maximally inappropriate, like in the front of a '76 Honda Civic or the back of a Fiat X1/9?

99 (edited by OnkelUdo 2018-08-02 04:34 PM)

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

nimblemotorsports wrote:

The viper v10 is totally and completely non-lemons-spirit as it isn't $500-my-ass, it is $5,000-my-ass.

I would at least go with a bmw v12, because that will certainly blow-up and is way more fun 'cheaty'  since its a BMW, whereas the viper motor is really good.

Lighten up...doing something totally stupid like this is in the Lemons spirit and I will bet a case of beer (again) it is C 0 at Gingerman.  It will compete against the likes of our (no longer) totally stock 1947 Plymouth.  If they beet us, we will be the FIRST to give them a victory beer.

Think back to the Radial engined MR2...I know Marc and that was not a $500 swap.

100 (edited by majo 2018-08-02 05:38 PM)

Re: I bought a Rolls Royce and want to build it.

That Rolls engine would look pretty sweet in my Imperial...…….

Looking forward to seeing this creation and battling you for class C domination at Gman!

COM ( Chief Operating Moron ) of Burnt Rubber Soul Racing
Current fleet: 95 Ford Probe, 81 Mazda 626.  Past: 81 Imperial
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