1 Topic by Lemon_Newton-Metre (edited by Lemon_Newton-Metre 2022-01-31 03:43 PM)

  • From: Elverson, PA
  • Registered: 2017-08-15
  • Posts: 1,118

Topic: $$$$$ Safety Equipment R & R for storage, longevity, swapping?

After preliminary installation of the seat, cage, and fire protection, are the most expensive (removable) parts of the safety equipment (seat, harness, bottle) relatively straightforward to remove and replace?

I only have unlocked outdoor parking for a build once completed. I have several build candidates in the "compact" to "mid-size" range; I have not yet selected where to start.

The key part: do the side panels (and general dimensions) of racing seats allow them to be removed through the cage when completed?

Yes, I know this depends on the particular seat, the vehicle, and the cage configuration, and seats are - in general - smaller than most people; but people (generally) bend and twist to fit through openings without plastic deformation.

I'm hoping the answer is:
1. "It really shouldn't be an issue with just about any seat, attachment method, and reasonable cage design for almost any car that size."

If the answer is:
2. "getting a (ex: Kirkey 65) out of a cage is going to be impossible without (removable steering wheel, cutting door bars, etc.), you should get a (X-brand° seat)",

then I need more measuring.

Thoughts?

  • From: Newport News, VA
  • Registered: 2015-12-23
  • Posts: 620

Re: $$$$$ Safety Equipment R & R for storage, longevity, swapping?

Pretty much 1.

I can't imagine how you could weld in a cage with the seat in place and still pass tech. It does sometimes require a bunch of tetris-like finagling for an exceptionally small cabin (like a Borgward Isabella Coupe), but generally possible.

Fire bottle and belts are easy-ish (sometimes the belts can be a pain depending on the cage design and seat mounting).

That guy
  • Registered: 2013-11-15
  • Posts: 668

Re: $$$$$ Safety Equipment R & R for storage, longevity, swapping?

Are you looking to be able to take the seat, belts and fire bottle out of the car after each race so it doesn't get stolen?

If so, that will be a pain in the rear.  I would rather suggest you keep the windows in the car and make sure you have original panels or make panels to cover the glass when the windows are rolled down for racing.  I stored mine car outside for years with just a tarp over it and no side windows.

Seats and belts are relatively easy to remove and the fire bottles are designed to be removed for recertification.  Getting the seat out of the car will depend on your cage design and seat preference, a removable steering wheel might help.

Spank daily drives his race Hyundai.  I believe he puts the factory seat(s) back in after a race at the track and drives it home.

Team whatever_racecar #745 Volvo wagon
  • From: Seattle, WA
  • Registered: 2009-10-28
  • Posts: 2,110

Re: $$$$$ Safety Equipment R & R for storage, longevity, swapping?

I'm also in the "pretty much 1" camp and agree that it's nice to keep the door windows, or at least to have a way to reinsert them and hold them in place during storage even if the doors themselves have been gutted.

Still, if it looks like your choice of vehicle and seat might result in a tight fit, remember this part of rule 3.5.1.7:

All cars must have passenger-side door bars meeting the same requirements (though not necessarily using the same design) as driver’s-side door bars.

If you end up with a set of door bars that you like but that won't let the seat pass, consider whether it would help to use a different bar design for the other side.

1982 MG Metro 1300: IOE 2015 Pacific Northworst GP, Longest Distance 2010 Cd'L Box Wine Country Classic
1980 KV Mini 1: Worst of Show and Fright Pig Supremo 2009 Concours d'Lemons
1978 H Special: Second-Round Elimination 2010 Lemons Pinewood Derby at Sears Pointless
1967 SAAB 96: IOE 2012 Pacific Northworst GP, Organizer's Choice 2022 Hell on Wheels California Rally
  • From: Camarillo, CA
  • Registered: 2021-03-26
  • Posts: 385

Re: $$$$$ Safety Equipment R & R for storage, longevity, swapping?

Smol car here (miata)... I've never found a seat that doesn't fit through the opening where the side window would be between the door bars and hoop. I'd imagine this is a non-issue so I wouldn't sweat it too much. I think the real question is why? The only seat we pull in and out is the passenger seat.. the driver seats only had to come in and out once.

Full Ass Racing
#455 Piñata Miata - 1990 Miata
#735 BMDollhÜr 7Turdy5i - 1990 735i
  • From: Flagstaff, AZ
  • Registered: 2020-09-05
  • Posts: 50

Re: $$$$$ Safety Equipment R & R for storage, longevity, swapping?

I just had to take the seat out to replace the harness and it was a pain. Not the Tetris (that was pretty easy) but getting to the bolts next to the trans tunnel was very tight. I can’t imagine a thief knowing the value of a seat and harness and then taking the time to remove them… unless you live in one of those neighborhoods where everything gets taken I guess, and in that case, what’s to stop a thief from climbing in, shifting to neutral and pushing the whole car away?

Now if you’re worried about environmental degradation of the harness from being outside, I guess I understand that. Either get a good tarp/car cover or get a quick release setup so you can unclip the belts - including the submarine that has to bolt in under the seat. That’s the problematic one.

  • From: Elverson, PA
  • Registered: 2017-08-15
  • Posts: 1,118

Re: $$$$$ Safety Equipment R & R for storage, longevity, swapping?

Thanks all, for the input.

Yes, part of my concern was more things leaving without my knowledge (generator, tow dolly, Highlander, etc.), I'm still a little gun-shy; though I'm considering it rent offset, and I'm now in a different location.

I have several build candidates; one's a _significant_ stretch.

My next step is to get a seat, pick the first car, measure for a cage, and get that installed; as I plan to build more than one, I was thinking about developing a plan for swapping.

  • From: Camarillo, CA
  • Registered: 2021-03-26
  • Posts: 385

Re: $$$$$ Safety Equipment R & R for storage, longevity, swapping?

Lemon_Newton-Metre wrote:

Thanks all, for the input.

Yes, part of my concern was more things leaving without my knowledge (generator, tow dolly, Highlander, etc.), I'm still a little gun-shy; though I'm considering it rent offset, and I'm now in a different location.

I have several build candidates; one's a _significant_ stretch.

My next step is to get a seat, pick the first car, measure for a cage, and get that installed; as I plan to build more than one, I was thinking about developing a plan for swapping.

Most thieves are opportunist thieves. Use weird hardware for stuff you don't want stolen, have a car cover, etc and they'll likely find a better candidate to steal from. Regardless, they're Lemons cars.. there's mold growing on our race car and I wouldn't imagine a thief would see that and go "wow, I bet they put a lot of money into this thing."

Also, what I've done in the past since I hate car alarms is just wire a blinking blue or red light. Sure, there's no alarm, but a thief is going to go to a car that doesn't have a blinking light.

Full Ass Racing
#455 Piñata Miata - 1990 Miata
#735 BMDollhÜr 7Turdy5i - 1990 735i
  • From: Houston, TX
  • Registered: 2012-06-21
  • Posts: 1,608

Re: $$$$$ Safety Equipment R & R for storage, longevity, swapping?

If taking the seat out is a pain in the ass, you could just remove the seat cover. That protects the fabric from the elements as well as making the seat itself a less likely target.

Escape Velocity Racing
  • VKZ24
  • VKZ24
  • Lemons Staff Stalker
  • Offline
  • From: Wilson, NC
  • Registered: 2009-05-20
  • Posts: 1,839

Re: $$$$$ Safety Equipment R & R for storage, longevity, swapping?

Camper Van Someren wrote:

I just had to take the seat out to replace the harness and it was a pain.

Same here. 

Once the cage is in place, it seems everything else is a PITA to gain easy access.  The only [somewhat] saving grace is our car is a 3-door hatch, so we can climb in the hatch to access some things than might be inaccessible is a typical 2-coor coupe with a trunk.

Captain
Team Super Westerfield Bros.
'93 Acura Integra - No VTEC Yo!

VKZ24's Website