76 (edited by PunisherBass 2011-03-29 02:28 PM)

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

DC Doug wrote:

Clearly Sears Pointless is just bad for the series.  It should obviously be dropped from the schedule and another Summit Point / Capitol Offense (Fall) should be added.

Nick, please get busy on this; let me know if you need further direction.  That is all.

And we need Judge Scott on the east coast as well.

Team Final Gear Crew Chief
#138 1997 Pontiac GTP - Supercharged 3800
#42   1999 Ford P71 Crown Vic

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

Again, to repeat Dean, It was about half gallon of water in the fuel cell. Not in our cans, not in our barrels, in our fuel cell. It's a cell, the cap was on, we fuel with our cans, no one else's. The water got into the cell only. It is what it is, it's over now, the car is good. We will take other precautions and go on with our lives.
The subject of the other possible sabotage just sucks. I feel bad for those guys. No one deserves it, period.

Smokey Yunick, Jim Hall, Chad Knaus, and Me...

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

The water in the tank sounds like the end result of someone being drunk wandering the grounds w a bottle of water looking for a place to dump it. I've stayed late at a few Lemons races when racing is done for the day, some people are absolutely hammered when it's only 11pm. I can believe someone completely hammered doing something like this.

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

Quiky wrote:

We run a 250amp solenoid/cutoff that requires 2.5 amps while active to keep the power hot.  If you leave it active without running the car, it will drain the battery.

Right and crews never leave things like this over-looked, crews are not tired, thinking of 100's of other things so it's just easy to blame others.  I watched a car enter the track with a helmet on the roof and the driver walked off HANS in hand and not much more.

Jalopyshoppe wrote:

Again, to repeat Dean, It was about half gallon of water in the fuel cell. Not in our cans, not in our barrels, in our fuel cell. It's a cell, the cap was on, we fuel with our cans, no one else's. The water got into the cell only. It is what it is, it's over now, the car is good. We will take other precautions and go on with our lives.
The subject of the other possible sabotage just sucks. I feel bad for those guys. No one deserves it, period.

Do you think there is a 1% chance it was team error?  I think there is a 99% chance it was team error.

Justice...with a smile.

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

PunisherBass wrote:
DC Doug wrote:

Clearly Sears Pointless is just bad for the series.  It should obviously be dropped from the schedule and another Summit Point / Capitol Offense (Fall) should be added.

Nick, please get busy on this; let me know if you need further direction.  That is all.

And we need Judge Scott on the east coast as well.

Totally agree (funny how that happened)

And yes, none of this would have happened if Judge Scott had been there - - - or, it would have been a completely worse clusterf**k had he been there.  I'm betting on the former; bring Judge Segway EAST (along w/ another Summit/NJ race)!

Nick, again, if you need further direction please being let us knowz!

That is all.

Doug! !

Speedycop/NSF Racing /Pinewood Dirtbags
'10 Summit, CMP3, Autobahn, '11 CMP1, NJMP, CMP2, Summit, G'man, Stafford, Charlotte, Autobahn, ECR '12 CMP1, NJMP, G'man, NHMS1, Summit, CMP2, NHMS2, ECR, '13 CMP1, ECR, Summit, NJMP, THill, CMP2, MSR, NHMS, Sears '14 Barber, Sears1, ECR, CMP1, NJMP1, BWillow, Sebring, CMP2, THill, Sears2, '15 Sears1, Barber, Ridge, THill, '16 Sears1

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

"Sparky" Pete wrote:

If I find out someone thought it would be funny if an MGB leaked oil... so help me god.

I think that person must have helped design all British cars and motorcycles.   :-)

But if it were a deliberate act (which I doubt), I would cheerfully help you force feed them the oil filter.

A friend who has suffered major oil leaks on British cars says that an MG will run an awfully long time with little or no oil.   Therefore, I probably failed in not checking the oil pressure as soon as I got in the car, since it may very well have already been zero.

"I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it!"
IOE winner in the Super Snipe -- Buttonwillow 2012
IOE winner in Super Snipe v2.0 -- Buttonwillow 2016
"Every Super Snipe in Lemons has won an IOE!"

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

I hear there's some guy named Lucas who sets fire to Brit electricals!  He must be stopped, that villain!!!

Speedycop/NSF Racing /Pinewood Dirtbags
'10 Summit, CMP3, Autobahn, '11 CMP1, NJMP, CMP2, Summit, G'man, Stafford, Charlotte, Autobahn, ECR '12 CMP1, NJMP, G'man, NHMS1, Summit, CMP2, NHMS2, ECR, '13 CMP1, ECR, Summit, NJMP, THill, CMP2, MSR, NHMS, Sears '14 Barber, Sears1, ECR, CMP1, NJMP1, BWillow, Sebring, CMP2, THill, Sears2, '15 Sears1, Barber, Ridge, THill, '16 Sears1

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

CowDriver wrote:

A friend who has suffered major oil leaks on British cars says that an MG will run an awfully long time with little or no oil.   Therefore, I probably failed in not checking the oil pressure as soon as I got in the car, since it may very well have already been zero.

4 1/2 hours to be exact. And I still have last year's Sears-Pointless Iron-Trophy sitting in my driveway to prove it. big_smile

Remarkably, I can't remove the oil dip-stick.

"Real ZomBees prefer Bacon"
IOE(x2) MGB/SAAB 96, Judge's Choice, Class C Win, & 2011 Hooniverse Car of the Year!
MRolla, Stick Figure/Animal House, Free Range MR2, SAAB Sonett, "The Death Flip"
2008 Exoskeleton Jag Fiasco, Concours d Lemons - Rue Britannia, worse British car.

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

I'm glad the fuel door on my Maserati still has a working release that even I still have a hard time remembering the location of. Not that anyone would have messed with our super competitive Maserati racing machine!

Sometimes we assume foul play when there is another explanation. I was totally convinced until this morning that someone had siphoned fuel out of my van that was parked all weekend in our paddock spot. I had filled it up just before getting to the track and when I left the track I had only 2/3rds of a tank. However, a review of my credit card puchases show that the station I filled at just before going to the track only billed $75 to my card. This means that it shut off automatically at $75 (Don't you hate that?) and I did not realise the tank was not filled. It take over $100 these days to fill my van (Don't you hate that even more!?)

Pendejo Engineering "Captain" - 1991 Alfa 164
1983 Shaguar XJ-S V-12 "The Two Ton Miata"
1995 Mercedes S600 V-12  - First car ever CLAIMED by JAY!
1980 Maserati Quattroporte - Judge's Choice

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

I still don't believe that anybody has ever flipped on a kill switch with malicious intent. It's just as quick to slice a brake hose, dump a gallon of roofing nails mixed with gear oil on the driver's seat, or drop a handful of popcorn kernels in the radiator. Not that I'm trying to give anyone ideas.

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

Someone stole the pcv valve off my car overnight at the Buttonwillow race and replaced it with a cap.

“Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.”

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

As much as I want to stand on a soap box and defend my team, I'm done...
I know what I know, and that's that. I pumped 2.5 gallons of fuel out before the fuel was clear.
So, that makes about half gallon of actual water. Now it's out of the tank, and we all learned that we should be a bit more cautious about securing things. It sucks, move on.

Smokey Yunick, Jim Hall, Chad Knaus, and Me...

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

After theorizing on this (i was watching trekkor's feed when someone mentioned it) I can pretty much write off all the listed pranks/sabotage as possibility for crew error...well, maybe except reorienting the eyesore miata and the water in the tank incident. at least with the T-GT the gang did some forensics on their fuel sources and filler jugs. I could definitely see someone being jealous of it. Not saying any of the wonderful guys I've come to know through Lemons would do anything like that, though. It doesn't just doesn't add up right. My initial impressions would have been that there was some water in a fuel jug that got topped off with fuel, then poured into the T-GT's tank. other than that, I don't believe any legitimate pooling/condensation theories on the basis that they probably would have been off-track with fuel problems on Saturday. dead battery, we have these nifty red LED eyes in the dragon's head that feed directly off the kill switch. Awesome for hot pits, night racing, and buttoning up for the night because you can tell from 40ft away whether the car's dead or not. plug wires come loose from vibration, Doug and I know this from Southern discomfort this year. Nothing some bad ass zip-tying can't fix. Needless to say, but i would be -VERY- on edge coming back in the morning and seeing my car re-oriented. We probably would have scrutinized the entire car top to bottom over it. A sticker on the lemon, or a chicken wing in the grab handle, yeah, ok, But I'm in the "don't mess with my racecar" group, so movement, changes to the car's orientation gives me more cause for alarm. It's all over, so lets move on, and next time it happens, we'll just have to show'em where waste water goes.

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

My Step-Dad's brother (step-uncle?) had a car in high school that was smaller than a mini.

People would carry it around the lot to hide it from him.  I think that's pretty funny.

Silent But Deadly Racing-  Ricky Bobby's Laughing Clown Malt Liquor Thunderbird , Datsun 510, 87 Mustang (The Race Team Formerly Known as Prince), 72 Pinto Squire waggy, Parnelli Jones 67 Galaxie, Turbo Coupe Surf wagon.(The Surfin Bird), Squatting Dogs In Tracksuits,  Space Pants!  Roy Fuckin Kent and The tribute to a tribute to a tribute THUNDERBIRD/ SUNDAHBADOH!

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

If rain water was able to get into the T GT's tank, I think it would have had some problems keeping the fuel IN the tank. Sound slike obvious sabotage. That's not funny, not cool, and not acceptable. It's pathetic and un-LeMons.

Team Captain: #808 Licensed to Ill Mini Truck

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

Wish I could say our poor Saturday performance was the result of Mother Nature or some other idiot. Word to the wise (unlike me on car prep day)….don’t use any silicone or other sealers anywhere near gasoline! Tends to breakdown and clog up your entire f$%#@ fuel system. Guess I slept through that part of auto shop class.

Hit n Run Racing
ORANGE V8 MAZDA RX7
Santa Cruz, CA

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

Judge Phil wrote:

I still don't believe that anybody has ever flipped on a kill switch with malicious intent.

I agree. Not here.

IF (and that's a big if) there were any hijinks in the pits Saturday night I think/hope it would have been due to a 2am inebriated lack of judgement rather than any inherent malice or character flaw.

There is always the one (or two) drunk guy/gals in a group who can't tell the difference between funny and f@&#ing stuff up, usually followed by a sudden violent reversal of their newly pickled digestive track. There WAS some unusually rambunctious partying going on. 2 stints in the Navy overseas showed me just how Jekyll/Hyde people can get with that magic elixir C2H5OH.

The bigger that Lemons gets and the wider net we throw, the larger variety of characters we include so it's a good lesson in caution if nothing else. Our tight-knit community is as vulnerable to interlopers as any other group. Even so I'd be surprised if we ever saw it again. Too much heat to go unnoticed - which is a good thing.

But as the saying goes, a good lock keeps an honest man honest. Move on, but keep your eyes open for your friend's sake... just in case.

"Real ZomBees prefer Bacon"
IOE(x2) MGB/SAAB 96, Judge's Choice, Class C Win, & 2011 Hooniverse Car of the Year!
MRolla, Stick Figure/Animal House, Free Range MR2, SAAB Sonett, "The Death Flip"
2008 Exoskeleton Jag Fiasco, Concours d Lemons - Rue Britannia, worse British car.

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

Again, my question was not answered, could it be 1% sabotage and 99% sleepy and tired team or the other way around and I would bet all day long the vote would go my way.  This is not Saturday night dirt track racing in the South where you have to defend your sisters honor by winning a race while avoiding the sheriff and Boss Hogg.

Justice...with a smile.

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

In general, of course it's 100 times more likely to be a tired team's mistake.  I don't think that is in question at all.  Many times I've personally had things STOLEN!!! from my pit space only to find them in my support vehicle the next morning, right where I left them. smile

I happen to have personal knowledge of only one of the "incidents" so that's the only one I can comment on.  We spent hours trying to figure out what we did wrong so that we could learn from the mistake and make sure it never happens again.  We weren't looking for any excuse, nor do we blame our results in even any small way on the fact that there was water in our fuel cell.  Either someone put water in our fuel cell (and if they did, I give it a 99.9% probability that it was a drunken act of stupidity, not a malicious act) or we made a mistake that we weren't able to uncover after hours of investigation.

Assign whatever probability you want.  Have a vote.  Take a poll.  Sign a petition.  Call me directly and tell me we obviously screwed up and to stop being a bunch of whining pussies.  I think there's a 51/49 chance it was us, but that doesn't matter either, because:

We're going to be even MORE more careful in how we store and fill our fuel jugs.  We're going to redouble our efforts to examine each fuel jug before we pour fuel into it and it into the car.  These are the precautions in case WE messed up.

We are also going to be a lot more careful about leaving stuff unattended overnight.  This is the precaution in case of the 1% chance (that seems to be the popular vote, right?)  that drunk idiots wander by our car when they need to take a piss or empty their water bottle.

We'll never know so we're learning from all the possibilities.  See, this was a GOOD thing!

Cheers,

Dean

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

Dean - I'm trying to think this one out - I'm still thinking one of the hose-top cans you or I (john) had brought might have been under the easy-up at the edge of the trailer
- My Vanagon had the door cracked open Friday night (g/f didn't want to wake me slamming it) and we filled with water. As in I was still drying out the inside on Monday. The awning at the door was similar in layout to what the EZ-up and the trailer had
- I can imagine water coursing down *something* (the amount of rain we had it could have just come down the leg of the ez-up) and getting a pint or maybe a quart in the neck of one of those jugs - which would then sink.... and if you didn't use them 'til Sunday, that would do it and you wouldn't have caught it.
~of course, that is if you used one of those jugs, and when~

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

dtfastbear wrote:

In general, of course it's 100 times more likely to be a tired team's mistake.  I don't think that is in question at all.  Many times I've personally had things STOLEN!!! from my pit space only to find them in my support vehicle the next morning, right where I left them. smile

I happen to have personal knowledge of only one of the "incidents" so that's the only one I can comment on.  We spent hours trying to figure out what we did wrong so that we could learn from the mistake and make sure it never happens again.  We weren't looking for any excuse, nor do we blame our results in even any small way on the fact that there was water in our fuel cell.  Either someone put water in our fuel cell (and if they did, I give it a 99.9% probability that it was a drunken act of stupidity, not a malicious act) or we made a mistake that we weren't able to uncover after hours of investigation.

Assign whatever probability you want.  Have a vote.  Take a poll.  Sign a petition.  Call me directly and tell me we obviously screwed up and to stop being a bunch of whining pussies.  I think there's a 51/49 chance it was us, but that doesn't matter either, because:

We're going to be even MORE more careful in how we store and fill our fuel jugs.  We're going to redouble our efforts to examine each fuel jug before we pour fuel into it and it into the car.  These are the precautions in case WE messed up.

We are also going to be a lot more careful about leaving stuff unattended overnight.  This is the precaution in case of the 1% chance (that seems to be the popular vote, right?)  that drunk idiots wander by our car when they need to take a piss or empty their water bottle.

We'll never know so we're learning from all the possibilities.  See, this was a GOOD thing!

Cheers,

Dean

I can live with this.

Justice...with a smile.

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

Judge Scott wrote:

This is not Saturday night dirt track racing in the South where you have to defend your sisters honor by winning a race while avoiding the sheriff and Boss Hogg.

Honor?   My sister ain't got no honor!   smile
I'm not sure why, but I just got an invitation to her wedding.   She's only been living with the guy for something like 12 years.

"I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it!"
IOE winner in the Super Snipe -- Buttonwillow 2012
IOE winner in Super Snipe v2.0 -- Buttonwillow 2016
"Every Super Snipe in Lemons has won an IOE!"

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

Judge Scott wrote:

I can live with this.

x2

-Matt

30 Time Loser with Class C, Index of Effluency, I got Screwed and Heroic Fix Trophies who usually races, according to Car and Driver, The Greatest Road Racing Cherokee in History.

Check out our FB Page and follow our various exploits.

99

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

dtfastbear wrote:

Many times I've personally had things STOLEN!!! from my pit space only to find them in my support vehicle the next morning, right where I left them. smile

Reminds me of an old Steven Wright sketch; "I returned home one night and found that EVERYTHING in my apartment was stolen... and replaced with exact duplicates..."

Re: Paddock car sabotage overnight at Sears...WEAK!!

That's EXACTLY what happened to me!  Bastard saboteurs.