Topic: Endurance racing

I'm quiete  new to Lemons, I'm the mechanic and driver. So when things get broke or tore up I'm the one to fix it, and it's easy to have some resentment towards so called aggressive drivers on your own team.  Here's my question, let's say we have a top 15 car, in a endurance race where would you like to see your driver drive the car. At 80 % and spare the car or 100% and possibly break  the car before the checkered flag.

Re: Endurance racing

It's always a crapshoot. Moreso in crapcan racing than any other.

To complete more laps than anyone else (different from Winning)
Drive a pace that
A) the driver is ALWAYS in control of the car.
2) the driver can maintain that measured effort for however long it takes to burn up a full tank of fuel
iii) the car can withstand

In the above order of importance. The driver variables are more within your control than the car variables. Everyone wants to focus on the car as the weakest link. At some point, it will be. But fixing the the driver and team organization can make up more time and help gain more laps than any part that you bolt onto a top 15 car.

Re: Endurance racing

To win, you have to finish.

Personally, I don't think it's possible for too many drivers to drive at 10/10 for a full couple of hours or more.  Sure, perhaps some can, but most cannot.  How many races do you guys have under your belts?  Are there patterns developing?  One driver getting too many black flags?  One driver breaking something every time out?

Turning lap times consistently faster than everybody else on your team is great if you can do it without breaking things and with staying out of trouble.  But all it takes is one unplanned stop to negate an hour or two worth of great lap times.

If you're doing all of the fixing, and somebody else is doing all of the breaking, then at some point you need to have a discussion.  Especially if they're not helping with the fixing.


Re: Endurance racing

There are a lot of factors with a "team" of drivers.
Clearly, there needs to be an understanding that, as a team,
all drivers are responsible for the well being of the car.

If your "teammates" are resistant to the idea of slowing down to go faster,
point out that the $2000+ spent on a race is pissed away when they break the car
or earn black flags.

Good Luck.

Capt. Delinquent Racing
The One & Only Taurus V8 SHO #31(now moved on to another OG Delinquent)
'17 Vodden the Hell - (No) Hope for the Future Award, '08 AMP Survivor, '08 ARSE-FREEZE-APALOOZA Mega-Cheater

Re: Endurance racing

I ask my drivers to think (I know, but I do) - if every driver drove every lap like the one you just completed would the car be guaranteed to last the race and stay on track (mechanically, avoiding contact, and with black flags).  If the answer is no, then they need to change their driving. 

I usually order stints in the likelihood of drivers coming back with the car intact - so the drivers who are most likely to come back on the hook go last.  I also have a sign in the car - "Save tires and brakes for the last driver."  That kind of gets the point across. 

When you say you are the mechanic - are you the sole mechanic?  Don't your drivers help fix the car too?  I find that helps too.

--Rob Leone Schumacher Taxi Service
We won the IOE at Southern Discomfort.
We got screwed at The Real Hoopties of New Jersey  and we took cars down with us.
We got the curse at Capitol Offense but they wouldn't let us destroy the car.

Re: Endurance racing

To answer your original question, 80% is mo betta than 100%.  Most of these cars won't last 8hrs driving 100%.  They just don't have enough brakes, cooling or more importantly, skill behind the wheel.  I can give around 5 good 100% laps before I start wondering whether the Angels are wasting Trout's talents or what the wife is doing,etc. 2 hours of 100% is beyond my abilities.  Whenever I'm sitting in the car, always in the back of my mind is the reminder that someone else will be sitting in this seat after me so I damn well better leave something left for them to drive.

1990 RX7 "Mazdarita" 
1994 Jaguar XJ12 (Winner C-Class 2013 Sears Pointless)
1964 Sunbeam Imp (IOE 2013 Sears Pointless)
1980 Rover SD1 (I Got Screwed 2014 Return of Lemonites) (Sold -> Houston.  Gone and forgotten)

Re: Endurance racing

This has been a big topic with our team.  Being that this will be our first race, we will run the car no more than 80%, pit every hour if we need to or not to fuel and change drivers, and just be aware.  Our big goal is to drive across the finish line on Sunday.

Skip "Mongo" L.
Team DadBod

Re: Endurance racing

I think current LeMans cars have people thinking they should run 100% all the time.  Really these behave more like the older times when you had to take care of your cars or you would lose to the team that preserves their car.

Look at it this way, even if you don't throw a rod through your block, consumables can easily lose a race.  If you have to change your brakes while green will take way more time than you can make up in the entire race by late breaking.  Having to replace tires will lose you multiple laps, and you can win by eliminating one fuel stop.

Racing 4 Nickels - 1989 Oldsmobile Cutlass Ciera
2012 The Chubba Cheddar Enduro Class C winner
Facebook Page

Re: Endurance racing

There are some many cars on the track at any given time I'm not sure how anybody could go 100% very long.  Everybody should be helping wrench on the car.  If you notice a driver is a tad aggressive talk to them.

"get up and get your grandma outta here"

Re: Endurance racing

Nothing wrong with not inviting guys back either.  Most team members who I've talked to have changed driving habits.  I could care less if they are slow, just don't hit things and stay out of the way of faster cars.  We had one guy that when our two cars broke during the same hour and 9 guys were wrenching on one of the 2 he took off his shirt, put on some shades, and started sun bathing in a chair.  Yea, he was not asked back.  Ironically, he was a one of the fastest drivers, track member, SCCA, blah blah blah,.  I don't give a damn, you can at least get everyone a beer while we figure crap out.

Team Glue Sticks
00 Firebird, 02 X-Type, 93 NX2000, 00 Mazda 626 (Sold)
2016 NJMP Heroic Fix, 2017 NJMP Near Heroic Fix except we can't drive

Re: Endurance racing

You never start at 10/10ths. Not until your car and team are known. After a couple races, when you have your car and it's weaknesses figured out, and you know if you have a team that can work together and respect the fact that others need to be able to drive, then you start pushing. It's better to drive all weekend at 7/10ths than it is to have one driver that goes 10/10ths and ruins the car for everyone.

As far as actually going 10/10ths in a Lemons field,  good luck. I would say in any given race I get 5 or fewer laps where I can put in that effort. Every single other one there are too many other factors like traffic, people blocking without realizing it, yellows, etc. Push when you can, but respect that you can't push all the time.

14 Time Loser FutilityMotorsport
2008 Saab 9-5Aero Wagon
Retired - 1989 Dodge Daytona Shelby 2011-2015 "Lifetime Award for Lack of Achievement" IOE, 3X I got screwed, Organizer's Choice

Re: Endurance racing

Thanks a bunch guys, totally appropriate your experience and advice.

Re: Endurance racing

Well, first step is don't spin out on the first lap at Gingerman smile

To me, Lemons is mostly about traffic management, particularly at the Midwest races. I drove for a team that placed second overall at Barber in February with the car being 10-30 seconds slower than class leaders. We just didn't stop, crash, or get penalties.

(this is your Lake neighbor, Nick BTW)