Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

Or do like they do in Formula E, buy several cosmetically challenged Leafs for hundreds of dollars each, put the same number on each, drive one until it is dead, then swap cars. Charge them overnight and repeat. There's a running/driving Leaf with cosmetic front end damage on Copart right now at $300 that ends tomorrow. Hell, that idea is so good that I may do it myself.

Everybody grab your brooms, it's shenanigans!

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

rmcdaniels wrote:

Or do like they do in Formula E...

Swapping battery trays was a good plan. Our charging infrastructure was, let's say, unfortunate.

We don't have Formula E money. So you want a fleet of cars... $300 for the car (not counting what it will take to fix the wreck that totaled in the first place), $1000 for a cage (or half that with you booger-welding it in), $400 seat, $200 harness, $300 fire suppression system (required in 2019)  Plus the car hauler to bring 6 of them. I thought you were better at math.

I like the idea of the EV racecar - lord knows I've burned truck loads of money on one. It was first brought out as a joke. Then we've stuck with it because people marvel at the idiocy, the hopeless optimism. Some day battery technology may reach a level to support motorsports, and CMP might have a power outlet that could run more than a lightbulb -- I'm not sure I'll live long enough to see either of those. Fuel cell technology is mostly there -- if stupid expensive, but does have the slight issue of carrying around a 3000psi can of hydrogen. (LPG -- aka. autogas -- might fly under the Lemons rules, but it would have to a mostly butane mix to not be 300+ psi, but it's still an explosion risk.)

Duff Beer Civic (#128) -- 2014 Sebring - Class B (#1 of 7), 2016 Barber - Class B
1981 Jet Electrica 007 [Plymouth Horizon TC3] (#128) -- Mk.1 - Index of Effluency Eco (IOEe) @ 2016 Lemons South Fall, Mk.2 - Judges' Choice @ 2017 'Shine Country Classic, Mk.3 - Index of Effluency @ 2017 Southern Discomfort

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

How dare you criticize my math! I'm pretty much the Carlo Ponzi of Lemons math.

You just need to rationalize all of your numbers and assumptions, and then apply a time factor.

You start with two cars, charge one while the other is driving. These already have good built in chargers and BMSs, so we don't have the EV-Peak-blow-up-the-last-cell-in-the-chain problem and you can safely do 80% charges. Then you make some unrealistically optimistic spreadsheets about how this is going to work, haul one car and drive the other (or drive both, there are L3 fast chargers all down 95 and 20 on the way there), and then see what you get. I'm guessing that you will do way more laps than we did in our first EV race. Every year you add a couple of cars and make improvements to the cars that you have, and then just keep doing that until DOMINATION! Of course at some point you do end up with a Speedycop-class car hauler and a fleet of terrible race cars, probably about three years in, but you can worry about that later. For now all you need is a couple of slightly mangled Leafs and a big ass generator and you're in business.

Everybody grab your brooms, it's shenanigans!

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

And it's on again, moving the gen set under the hood and relocating a bunch of other stuff to make room for a passenger. I'm hoping to have it ready for the Rally after the CMP 24-hour race:

http://www.carolinahondas.com/members/roger-albums-pj-picture6800-jete10.jpg
http://www.carolinahondas.com/members/roger-albums-pj-picture6801-jete11.jpg

Everybody grab your brooms, it's shenanigans!

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

Under hood area reconfigured and wired up to make some space:

http://www.carolinahondas.com/members/roger-albums-pj-picture6808-electrica1.jpg


Passenger area cleared out with charger moved to center trunk to make room for a navigator:

http://www.carolinahondas.com/members/roger-albums-pj-picture6806-electrica3.jpg


Gen set under hood on bracket with aluminum heat shield between it and motor:

http://www.carolinahondas.com/members/roger-albums-pj-picture6807-electrica2.jpg


I still need to get some better seats, mount the gen set control panel, run an exhaust, get a big roof rack to hold our crap, get a fuel tank connected to it, and figure out how to vent the hood so air flows up from the bottom, but it's coming together.

Everybody grab your brooms, it's shenanigans!

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

Looking good! I love this terrible vehicle and your dedication to making it work.

rmcdaniels wrote:

figure out how to vent the hood so air flows up from the bottom

Why not the other way around? An air dam should keep pressure low under the car while helping your fuel mileage. Then you can suck air down from the relatively high pressure over the hood.

[Caution: I am not an aerodynamics engineer]

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

Mostly because at this point the electric motor is the weakest link in the chain thermally. I'd like to move hot air from the gen set out of the engine bay without moving it down by the motor. I'm currently thinking hood louvers made out of louvered HVAC vent covers set over holes in the hood on either side of the gen set.

Everybody grab your brooms, it's shenanigans!

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

The area over the hood ought to be low pressure; the high pressure area doesn't start until the base of the windshield.  You want a damn under the radiator to direct air up and into the engine compartment, and louvers above the engine bay to let hot air rise and escape. 

You can cut hood louvers for free, they also serve as nice lift-off points for the hood.

Tunachuckers: 15 Years of Effluency
'08 - '10: 1966 Volvo 122, "Charlie"
'10 - '18: 1975 Ford LTD Landau --> 2018 - current: Converted into 1950 "Plymford"
'22 - current: 1967 Volvo 122, "Charlie ]["

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

I was looking at louvers, but Ricky said that we may not want to get rain on the electrical equipment under the hood. Now I'm considering something like this. The flow through the horizontal tube should create a low pressure area that will draw air up out of the vertical tube:

http://www.carolinahondas.com/members/roger-albums-pj-picture6809-tubes1.jpg

Everybody grab your brooms, it's shenanigans!

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

Reducer (actually expander in this case) on either end to create a venturi effect?

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

I'm thinking that I shouldn't need it. The only reason for the horizontal tube is to keep the rain off. This would work just as well (or better) with just a pipe sticking up out of the hood perpendicular to the air flow.

Everybody grab your brooms, it's shenanigans!

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

rmcdaniels wrote:

I'm thinking that I shouldn't need it. The only reason for the horizontal tube is to keep the rain off. This would work just as well (or better) with just a pipe sticking up out of the hood perpendicular to the air flow.

But think of all the cool impromtu Bernoulli discussions you could have!

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

We're still talking Bernoulli, the speed is greater in one pipe than it is in the other, but not because of a decrease in size. I just have one pipe in a 50MPH breeze and the other is in still air. I've had this work against me before when I made my Targa air conditioner and it should move a lot of air.

Everybody grab your brooms, it's shenanigans!

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

It's like a carburetor.

Tunachuckers: 15 Years of Effluency
'08 - '10: 1966 Volvo 122, "Charlie"
'10 - '18: 1975 Ford LTD Landau --> 2018 - current: Converted into 1950 "Plymford"
'22 - current: 1967 Volvo 122, "Charlie ]["

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

OnkelUdo wrote:

Reducer (actually expander in this case) on either end to create a venturi effect?

And that was required. I cut the bottom out of a beer cup and duct taped it in one end of the tee.

I tested it last night out my truck window while driving to Norfolk. It was drawing a pretty good amount of air out of the cabin. For a total investment of $5, this works pretty well for moving air with no electricity or moving parts. I'll put a half dozen or so (or maybe more just for looks, something this good-looking is bound to enhance the appeal of any vehicle) on the hood to evacuate the hot air off the generator, and maybe a couple on the roof for battery box ventilation. It would be interesting to run one to a small tube for silent reverse helmet ventilation. 

http://www.carolinahondas.com/members/roger-albums-pj-picture6810-vent1.jpg
http://www.carolinahondas.com/members/roger-albums-pj-picture6812-vent3.jpg
http://www.carolinahondas.com/members/roger-albums-pj-picture6811-vent2.jpg

Everybody grab your brooms, it's shenanigans!

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

This is some Apollo-13 level shit!

"THE WONDERMENT CONSORTIUM"
Everything dies baby that's a fact,
But maybe everything that dies someday comes back?

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

Amazon dropped off the fuel system today. I opted for gravity feed because we all know about the legendary reliability of Trabants, so this will be strapped to a roof rack with the line run down to the engine bay.

The song running through my head as I craft this abomination is always Johnny Cash singing "One Piece at a Time".

http://www.carolinahondas.com/members/roger-albums-pj-picture6814-fueling.jpg

Everybody grab your brooms, it's shenanigans!

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

rmcdaniels wrote:

Amazon dropped off the fuel system today. I opted for gravity feed because we all know about the legendary reliability of Trabants, so this will be strapped to a roof rack with the line run down to the engine bay.

The song running through my head as I craft this abomination is always Johnny Cash singing "One Piece at a Time".

http://www.carolinahondas.com/members/roger-albums-pj-picture6814-fueling.jpg


Just hopefully not "Ring of Fire".

294 (edited by rmcdaniels 2019-03-25 02:35 PM)

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

http://www.carolinahondas.com/members/roger-albums-pj-picture6817-ev1.jpg



https://youtu.be/cRlCDQjzLcs

It's finally drivable on the new power train.  I drove it around town for a bit running some errands.

Gravity feed doesn't work well for fueling the generator; it dies after a few minutes of use, so I put a little 3 PSI electric fuel pump in the fuel line. That made a big difference in how it runs overall, the RPM is much more stable and it feels/sounds much smoother under load than it ever did before, even before I deconstructed it. Maybe all of these things should have a fuel pump.

The handling is vastly improved; setting an additional 300-ish pounds over the front axle does a lot to make up for all of the weight over the rear axle. It drives more like a normal car now, hardly scary at all.

Under hard cornering, the oil will go away from the oil level sensor and it will shut down the generator, so I may have to disable that for racing. It's splash-oiled, so I'm not really hurting anything by sloshing it around the crank case.

The generator is still noisy, but not having the noise, heat, and vibration two inches from my right arm is much more tolerable. It may not even drive us insane after driving it for 5 straight days.

The generator creates a whole lot of heat, but it is ducted so it channels it out past the muffler, causing a big hot stream of air to shoot out of it at one point, right at the wiring harness, which gets all melty after a bit. I'll make a duct to carry it out of the hood and shield the wiring and contactor enclosure. For this trip it will be hoodless; I'll make a couple of lexan panels to shield the electrical bits from rain.

Everybody grab your brooms, it's shenanigans!

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

Heat shield so it doesn't melt my wiring harness:

http://www.carolinahondas.com/members/roger-albums-pj-picture6818-heatshield.jpg

Everybody grab your brooms, it's shenanigans!

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

All I can think of is, this must have been exactly what the scene looked like at Toyota World Engineering HQ about 25 years ago...

Tunachuckers: 15 Years of Effluency
'08 - '10: 1966 Volvo 122, "Charlie"
'10 - '18: 1975 Ford LTD Landau --> 2018 - current: Converted into 1950 "Plymford"
'22 - current: 1967 Volvo 122, "Charlie ]["

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

http://www.carolinahondas.com/members/roger-albums-pj-picture6819-sparkycovered.jpg

I made clear covers for all the sparky bits, put the door back on, and zip-tied the wires down. I think that we're ready to Rally.

Everybody grab your brooms, it's shenanigans!

298

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

Roger, one question.  Have you guys ever trimmed the tail off of a zip-tie?  That would drive me insane!

Captain
Team Super Westerfield Bros.
'93 Acura Integra - No VTEC Yo!

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

VKZ24 wrote:

Roger, one question.  Have you guys ever trimmed the tail off of a zip-tie?  That would drive me insane!

Whenever I do that, the cut off end is sharp enough to cut me if I'm working around it. I'd rather leave them dangling that put up with little nicks on my hands.

Everybody grab your brooms, it's shenanigans!

300

Re: "Racing" the Duff Beer Electric Car

rmcdaniels wrote:
VKZ24 wrote:

Roger, one question.  Have you guys ever trimmed the tail off of a zip-tie?  That would drive me insane!

Whenever I do that, the cut off end is sharp enough to cut me if I'm working around it. I'd rather leave them dangling that put up with little nicks on my hands.

Yep, so I trim all mine off flush with a razor knife.

Captain
Team Super Westerfield Bros.
'93 Acura Integra - No VTEC Yo!