1 (edited by corey_mck 2018-09-21 06:20 AM)

Topic: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

So I built this 2001 Impreza to race 4 cylinder dirt track:
https://s3.us-east-2.amazonaws.com/prod.mm.com/uploads/2018/06/18/1529329283_20180616_152046_mmthumb.jpg
It lasted one warm up, one heat, and 4 laps of a feature before developing a knock.  The local dirt tracks are sort of getting me down with strict rules and no way to enforce them, and drivers are showing up with high HP built cars and I don't like dirt track enough to spend the money to be competitive.

So, the car is still straight enough that I wouldn't mind running a few Lemons races with it.  Would someone mind going through the build thread below and seeing if anything on the cage stands out that would keep it from going through tech?  Also, would the half mesh screen be legal?

Re: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

Mandatory second post before I can post the build thread link.  Here's the only pic I have of the car on track:

https://s3.us-east-2.amazonaws.com/prod.mm.com/uploads/2018/06/18/1529332085_screenshot_2018-06-18-07-18-43_mmthumb.png

3 (edited by corey_mck 2018-09-21 06:21 AM)

Re: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

Build thread link with cage pics:
https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum … 057/page1/

Re: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

You would need an actual windshield, cage looks good as long as your spreader plates are 25in. Sq.

Re: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

addict#52 wrote:

You would need an actual windshield, cage looks good as long as your spreader plates are 25in. Sq.

No.

"3.J.1 Windshields. A sturdy, driver-protecting windshield is required; if glass, it must be OE-type. Real polycarbonate or strong, securely mounted steel mesh is also acceptable. Acrylic and all other non-polycarbonate plastics are not allowed.  All non-OE windshields must be thick enough and suitably braced to resist a heavy object striking the windshield at speed. "

I'm not sure if they'd allow half-width mesh though, you'd want to check on that.

6 (edited by addict#52 2018-09-21 08:00 AM)

Re: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

When did they change that? Let me rephrase that, you'll want one

Re: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

I believe mesh would be acceptable but you'll probably prefer to have a windscreen of glass or lexan.

Cage looks pretty darned good/great! I know Pagel will appreciate how you did that plinth box in the corner there. Only couple of eyebrow raising "Hmmmmmms":

Not sure what that pic is of the bolts through a spreader plate looking thing is that has a pipe welded to it and the spreader plate doesn't look to be welded. Something about door bar or door mouthing something or other?

The doors on the door bar may be looked at 2 or 3 times and things said or questions asked so the tech inspector understands what's going on there.

Also not so sure about welding the diff for road racing, but others can chime in.

Re: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

corey_mck wrote:

It lasted one warm up, one heat, and 4 laps of a feature before developing a knock.

Yup. Ready for Lemons.

1982 MG Metro 1300: IOE 2015 Pacific Northworst GP, Longest Distance 2010 Cd'L Box Wine Country Classic
1980 KV Mini 1: Worst of Show and Fright Pig Supremo 2009 Concours d'Lemons
1978 H Special: Second-Round Elimination 2010 Lemons Pinewood Derby at Sears Pointless
1967 SAAB 96: IOE 2012 Pacific Northworst GP, Organizer's Choice 2022 Hell on Wheels California Rally

9 (edited by VKZ24 2018-09-24 06:53 AM)

Re: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

As has been said, your cage work looks EXCELLENT, especially for a dirt track-based build.  The ones I see around here don't look NEARLY that good, so nice work man!  I'm pretty sure that will pass tech with flying colors.

A few comments based on what we do...endurance racing.


1. You need a windshield.  We race in the rain, and getting all wet sucks.
2. Though your cage is really nice, IMO your door bars are kind of high, and will make quick ingress/egress not much fun.
3. Looks like you have the doors bolted shut?  Yes, you can have doors that are bolted shut, but most road race cars have doors that open. The Duke Boys might have made jumping through the windows look like fun, but it's not. 
3. A welded diff on a road race car will probably suck.
4. Does your seat slide?  Unless all your drivers are the same height, that won't work.
5. You'll need to reset your suspension and alignment to turn left AND right.
6. Removing all the windows can have negative effects on aero. On some cars it actually pulls exhaust fumes inside the car, which is not good.

Our rules are easy to understand, so just read through them and be sure you will pass tech.

Captain
Team Super Westerfield Bros.
'93 Acura Integra - No VTEC Yo!

Re: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

You are ready, dirt is for pigs and dogs!!!
You will have some much fun in Lemons every one is nice and will all was help you out. As in other post install a full windshield with some kind of defroster. use a seat that you can adjust you may wish to rethink the drivers top bar for shore. The car is going to get the crap beat out of it for 7-9 hr a day with 3 to 4 drivers so think what will break and every thing will. if those are fuel lines in the car go steel and keep out of the car if you can or in a tube. When you get out of the car after 2 hrs of racing with 100+ cars you will be tiered and your ears will be ringing but pumped up for shore. DRVOLKs

Re: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

Welded diff is fine once you're on the track but sucks in the paddock. Expect lots of binding and groaning while you putter around the pits at 10mph.

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74 races so far.

Re: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

Echoing a few of the above comments.

You want a solid windshield. Rain, pieces falling off cars, cars blowing oil lines, stuff like that you'd like to keep outside the car.

You want rear glass/lexan in that car. Wagons have low pressure zones behind them and when you remove the glass they have a habit of pulling exhaust fumes into the car, which is not great for your driver when doing long stints.

The cage looks well built, but you need to evaluate ingress/egress. If they think it's too hard to get in and out of they'll make you change something. The extra vertical bars you have + the halo seat + a hans + having to go through a window make for a really interesting exit in an emergency.


Your seat doesn't need to slide, but you will need to evaluate it's position depending on your other drivers.

There's a few other things just to check. I didn't see what belts you used, but Lemons has some rules about how long certifications are valid for, read the rules and compare to what you have. Next year fire suppression systems will be mandatory for all cars, so that's an added expense. Check your kill switch location against the rules. In general read the rules completely (they are not long) and compare to your car.

20+ Time Loser FutilityMotorsport
Abandoned E36 Build
2008 Saab 9-5Aero Wagon
Retired - 1989 Dodge Daytona Shelby 2011-2015 "Lifetime Award for Lack of Achievement" IOE, 3X I got screwed, Organizer's Choice

Re: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

Sorry for the slow response, I picked up a project car and wanted to get it running and manual swapped before I lost interest!  Ha.

Anyway, thanks all for checking it out.  I do plan on adding a windscreen, and I guess I'll have to source a wiper setup again.  Maybe I should cut the wagon rear off and truck it instead of adding all that lexan?

Somehow I have 3 racing friends who are nearly identical dimensions as me, which is good because that seat is not on sliders. 

I also plan on adding fire suppression this winter.

For now, there's a hillclimb event coming up in a few weeks nearby, so I'm going to straighten the suspension / alignment out and shake it down on pavement.

I'm a little concerned about Subaru reliability.  For the hillclimb, I'm putting the stock 2.2 back in it.  Does anyone have any input on how well 2.2 or 2.5 Subarus hold up for endurance racing?

Re: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

Subarus historically do not fair well in Lemons.

20+ Time Loser FutilityMotorsport
Abandoned E36 Build
2008 Saab 9-5Aero Wagon
Retired - 1989 Dodge Daytona Shelby 2011-2015 "Lifetime Award for Lack of Achievement" IOE, 3X I got screwed, Organizer's Choice

Re: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

TheEngineer wrote:

Subarus historically do not fair well in Lemons.

Where is/are the weak point(s)?  I don't know any teams personally that run one, but we're toying with the idea of a Subaru drive train swap-in; mainly due to the proliferation of said make here in the NW.

Perennial Losers
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Re: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

Don't sweat the door bars and inop driver's door.  My car was also built this way, and I drove another car built this way this year.  Once you get used to it, I find it easier to get in and out of than opening the door.  You might want to consider rolling down the top of the door to give you a larger opening, plus make it easier on your backside.

"She's a brick house" 57th out of 121 and 5th in Class C, There Goes the Neighborhood 2013
"PA Posse" 21st out of 96 and 2nd in Class C, Capitol Offense 2013.
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Re: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

Mike98036 wrote:
TheEngineer wrote:

Subarus historically do not fair well in Lemons.

Where is/are the weak point(s)?  I don't know any teams personally that run one, but we're toying with the idea of a Subaru drive train swap-in; mainly due to the proliferation of said make here in the NW.

I don't know all of the specifics, but I just know I see a lot of subaru carnage. I think normally spun bearings? Lots of overheating too. I think i've seen at least one center diff issue too.


I'm sure someone will chime in with "ours has been flawless", but the reputation isn't amazing for them.

20+ Time Loser FutilityMotorsport
Abandoned E36 Build
2008 Saab 9-5Aero Wagon
Retired - 1989 Dodge Daytona Shelby 2011-2015 "Lifetime Award for Lack of Achievement" IOE, 3X I got screwed, Organizer's Choice

18 (edited by VKZ24 2018-10-02 05:33 AM)

Re: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

TheEngineer wrote:
Mike98036 wrote:
TheEngineer wrote:

Subarus historically do not fair well in Lemons.

Where is/are the weak point(s)?  I don't know any teams personally that run one, but we're toying with the idea of a Subaru drive train swap-in; mainly due to the proliferation of said make here in the NW.

I don't know all of the specifics, but I just know I see a lot of subaru carnage. I think normally spun bearings? Lots of overheating too. I think i've seen at least one center diff issue too.


I'm sure someone will chime in with "ours has been flawless", but the reputation isn't amazing for them.

FWIW, people say that all Hondas are junk and will blow the HG.  We've been racing a Honda for 10 years and still no HG issues.  The transmissions...that's another story!

Captain
Team Super Westerfield Bros.
'93 Acura Integra - No VTEC Yo!

Re: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

Subaru engines are known for spinning bearings and also blowing head gaskets. A lot of the Subaru blocks (can't tell you which designations because I'm not a Subaru guy) have open deck designs, which are generally unreliable in endurance racing.

Sorry For Party Racing! - 1985 Pontiac Firebird - Car #35

A race car exists only in two states: broken or in the process of becoming that way.

Re: Rate my dirt track car build, and tell me if it's Lemons worthy?

This is why you want a windshield. Without one, that con rod could have caused a LOT more damage to the soft juicy bits of the driver.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NwPfjXgh3ng

Myopic Motorsport's #888 Ceci n'est pas une Citron Thunderbird ("This is not a lemon" but a 1995 tbird w/ 93 V8 swap + shopping cart rear wing + engine mounted frito maker)
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