Re: Fuel Jug Tech

I had a bunch of these, and went to the racing fuel jugs for actual fueling, keeping these for storage & transport.

I made a bunch of modifications to the spout (including replacing it with an older non-valved spout) and cut the time in half from almost 5 minutes to just under 2 1/2 before giving up & going to the race-jugs.

It never dawned on me to vent-mod these. (slaps forehead) They are SOOO much easier to handle with the double grips. I'm gonna have to go back to experimenting!!

Parkwod60 wrote:

Just an FYI for newbies, you can take a normal DOT/CARB approved 5 gallon jug with the press to pour spout on it, cut the spring loaded safety off and drill a 1/2" hole in it and get a jug that dumps just about as fast as one of these and still looks like a normal jug. Buy yourself a handful of 1/2" diameter by 1" long lag bolts from Home Depot to plug the vent when you are transporting the jugs.

http://www.blitzusa.com/products/fuel/Containment/enviroflo/80033%205%20Gal%20Enviro-FloGas.jpg

Drill your vent on the top behind the handle. I think with a 1/2 inch hole I timed it dumping 5 gallons (of water) in about 15 seconds.

"Real ZomBees prefer Bacon"
IOE(x2) MGB/SAAB 96, Judge's Choice, Class C Win, & 2011 Hooniverse Car of the Year!
MRolla, Stick Figure/Animal House, Free Range MR2, SAAB Sonett, "The Death Flip"
2008 Exoskeleton Jag Fiasco, Concours d Lemons - Rue Britannia, worse British car.

Re: Fuel Jug Tech

555race wrote:
steve wrote:

I'm all for making fueling safer but shouldn't you be sending this to Jay for approval before just posting it on the forum like this?

This topic has been covered many times (search), I did not start this TECH for interpretations of the rules debate, you have opened that door.  I don't think that belongs here as neither you, me or 99.9% of anyone on this forum makes the rules or enforces them.   
I take great offense to your commentary that we are cheating and you would blow a whistle on us as such.  You have a different interpretation, so be it, but a problem exists and I have taken the time and effort to show a solution to the problem.  You on the other hand have been a commercial for Hunsaker and bad mouthed me.  Bravo, you have eliminated someone from the chances of being friends/allies/come to your aid at a race with that one tool you forgot to bring.  Be a problem solver.

But back to your question I pulled aside above: I'm not sure what I would need Jays approval for, he has seen our jugs at 5 of the 6 events we've done with them as we have always pitted with in a beer toss of TECH/BS/Penalty Box.  Hard to miss when they roll back and forth next to the Penalty box 20 times in a weekend.  As well as this hasn't been an issue for any other teams running similar setups. 

For everyone else, I hope the tech helps a few of you and stops you from wasting time recreating the wheel. 

Good luck at the track.


I would just like to see this rule clarified by Jay since he is the one that came on here on several post and made the comments about using unmodified jugs so I took that as his amendment to the rules but if that is not the case then I apologize for the comments. It would be great if Jay would clarify this before we end up having to buy "Spec" fuel jugs and bring them to tech before we can race. I'll leave it at that until Jay says otherwise since this is his game and were allowed to play in it.

2010, 26th @ CMP, 2011, 10th & 5th at CMP, 2012? (MIA), 2013 Spring CMP, 53rd, 2013 Fall CMP 44th, 2014 Barber 14th, 2014 CMP 46th, 2015 CMP 57th, 2015 CMP 80th, 2016 CMP 16th, 3rd in B class, Winner Judges choice, and First car under 2.0 liter Alex's lemon aide stand winner. 2017 WRL, Road Atlanta 43rd, 2017 NCM 9th O/A , 1st in B class, 2018 CMP 13th O/A 3rd in Class B

Re: Fuel Jug Tech

Sparky Pete wrote:

I had a bunch of these, and went to the racing fuel jugs for actual fueling, keeping these for storage & transport.

I made a bunch of modifications to the spout (including replacing it with an older non-valved spout) and cut the time in half from almost 5 minutes to just under 2 1/2 before giving up & going to the race-jugs.

It never dawned on me to vent-mod these. (slaps forehead) They are SOOO much easier to handle with the double grips. I'm gonna have to go back to experimenting!!

Parkwod60 wrote:

Just an FYI for newbies, you can take a normal DOT/CARB approved 5 gallon jug with the press to pour spout on it, cut the spring loaded safety off and drill a 1/2" hole in it and get a jug that dumps just about as fast as one of these and still looks like a normal jug. Buy yourself a handful of 1/2" diameter by 1" long lag bolts from Home Depot to plug the vent when you are transporting the jugs.


Drill your vent on the top behind the handle. I think with a 1/2 inch hole I timed it dumping 5 gallons (of water) in about 15 seconds.

Just drill a hole above the fill line between the 2 handles and plug it with a lag bolt. You will easily get the dump time down to less than 60 seconds. Bigger the hole faster it pours.

Constructor/Owner/Driver - Billy Beer Ford Futura

Re: Fuel Jug Tech

steve wrote:

I would just like to see this rule clarified by Jay since he is the one that came on here on several post and made the comments about using unmodified jugs so I took that as his amendment to the rules but if that is not the case then I apologize for the comments. It would be great if Jay would clarify this before we end up having to buy "Spec" fuel jugs and bring them to tech before we can race. I'll leave it at that until Jay says otherwise since this is his game and were allowed to play in it.

Once Jay comments, it will become law, and will work its way into the rules, and then as someone else has said, most all of the jugs folks show up with will not be allowed, including all of the racing jugs that are not DOT approved or designed for actually carrying fuel.

Time to move along, fuel jugs are not where you want your LeMony efforts to be focused.

Pucker Factor Racing - Gator-O-Rama, Feb '11, Yee-Haw It's Lemons Texas!, Oct '11
Scuderia Ignorante - Yee-Haw, It's Lemons Texas, Feb '12 (As seen in Car & Driver), Gator-O-Rama, Sept '13

Re: Fuel Jug Tech

Steve, the Evil Genius himself has modified fuel jugs and he posted pictures of them in the past.  Since he's the tech tyrant I would say it's not a problem.

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Re: Fuel Jug Tech

People, People, People.

No race series promoter who wants to continue living in something other than a cardboard box will EVER come online on a racers' forum and tell you that your ghetto-fabbed**  fuel jugs have official blessing. 

Nor would they ever come online and tell you anything for that matter.

It's just a bad idea to do so, and that is common sense.  There is a rule book. The insurance companies examine and approve the rulebook.  The rulebook is the Bible.  Heed the good book, or don't.  But, be prepared to deal with the consequences, such as lap penalties or removal from premises by trebuchet.


**(see what I did there - copyright scuderia ignorante 2013 all rights reserved that means you blipshift)

ALLEGEDLY!

-Dave
Scuderia Ignorante // Modena / Dearborn / Aichi Prefecture / West Texas

Re: Fuel Jug Tech

Let speedy jugs lie.

Re: Fuel Jug Tech

I stand corrected and admit it this is the email from Jay that I got today trying to clarify this mess.:  It's a judgment call. Obviously, what I don't want is clever geniuses doing stupid shit like pressurizing their cans or making them less safe by putting stupid holes where they shouldn't be. But a reasonable mod that simply gets the air out isn't going to be a big issue. That said, if you have any doubts about your own abilities to differentiate between reasonable and too-clever-by-half, by all means just buy something that's already good to go. The Hunsakers are really good, but there are other equally viable options out there for less if you search around some, so it's not like we're advocating any particular brand.

John "Jay" Lamm, Chief Perpetrator
24 HOURS OF Lemons
5675 Horton Street, Suite C
Emeryville CA 94608

So venting is "legal" if done well and your jugs do look like they were put together well so I have no other comments on this isssue and maybe the email will clear it up for some of us that were under the same impression from earlier comments from Jay on this topic.

One other clarification I said I would cry foul, not call you a cheater by saying foul I open that up to the officials for interpretation, sorry you got offended by that comment.

2010, 26th @ CMP, 2011, 10th & 5th at CMP, 2012? (MIA), 2013 Spring CMP, 53rd, 2013 Fall CMP 44th, 2014 Barber 14th, 2014 CMP 46th, 2015 CMP 57th, 2015 CMP 80th, 2016 CMP 16th, 3rd in B class, Winner Judges choice, and First car under 2.0 liter Alex's lemon aide stand winner. 2017 WRL, Road Atlanta 43rd, 2017 NCM 9th O/A , 1st in B class, 2018 CMP 13th O/A 3rd in Class B

Re: Fuel Jug Tech

Now see if maybe you can build something "Lemony" like this to keep the visors clear, Very cool, Literally haha   http://www.ogracing.com/fast-sidekick-h … ry-powered

2010, 26th @ CMP, 2011, 10th & 5th at CMP, 2012? (MIA), 2013 Spring CMP, 53rd, 2013 Fall CMP 44th, 2014 Barber 14th, 2014 CMP 46th, 2015 CMP 57th, 2015 CMP 80th, 2016 CMP 16th, 3rd in B class, Winner Judges choice, and First car under 2.0 liter Alex's lemon aide stand winner. 2017 WRL, Road Atlanta 43rd, 2017 NCM 9th O/A , 1st in B class, 2018 CMP 13th O/A 3rd in Class B

60 (edited by jrbe 2013-10-30 09:11 AM)

Re: Fuel Jug Tech

Easily done for way under $300 but where do you put the blower intake so there's no chance of blowing flames into the helmet? Maybe have it suck air out?..still not great but at least moving your head means changing the intake air quickly. A sealed/explosion proof fan motor would be a good idea too. I think some, maybe most bilge blowers are.

-Killer B's (as in rally) '84 4000Q 4.2V8. Audis never win?

Re: Fuel Jug Tech

jrbe wrote:

Easily done for way under $300 but where do you put the blower intake so there's no chance of blowing flames into the helmet? Maybe have it suck air out?..still not great but at least moving your head means changing the intake air quickly. A sealed/explosion proof fan motor would be a good idea too. I think some, maybe most bilge blowers are.


Yeah I wonder if some kind of spark arrestor would be in order on the intake side of the motor than maybe you wouldn't need a sealed motor as long as you could stop a flame before it gets to it. Worse thing would be stopping me if I was on fire, shades of Ricky Bobby.

2010, 26th @ CMP, 2011, 10th & 5th at CMP, 2012? (MIA), 2013 Spring CMP, 53rd, 2013 Fall CMP 44th, 2014 Barber 14th, 2014 CMP 46th, 2015 CMP 57th, 2015 CMP 80th, 2016 CMP 16th, 3rd in B class, Winner Judges choice, and First car under 2.0 liter Alex's lemon aide stand winner. 2017 WRL, Road Atlanta 43rd, 2017 NCM 9th O/A , 1st in B class, 2018 CMP 13th O/A 3rd in Class B

Re: Fuel Jug Tech

Spark arrestors wont stop flames, they just keep sparks from coming out of the exhaust (of an engine typically.)  The problem with a ventilation system while fueling a vehicle is sucking in gas fumes or fire as probable worst case.  Fumes are scary because static or something unexpected can light it off, then you have a helmet full of flames.  It should be more of a flash unless the fan is blowing in a burnable mixture. Sucking air out of the helmet could suck flames into the helmet if say your chest is somehow on fire. Thats what would freak me out about a fueling ventilation system. I dont think I'd use one.

I think an old/hit/expired SA helmet with anti fog on the lens is probably best (with a head sock as well) while fueling.

Sorry for the topic drift.

-Killer B's (as in rally) '84 4000Q 4.2V8. Audis never win?

Re: Fuel Jug Tech

Good old threads should never die.  Wanted to thank the original author, 555Race for this.  We just ran our first event and following the excellent tutorial, built these little beauties.

https://i.imgur.com/3TDsHea.jpg

They worked beautifully, dumping 5 gallons in under 20 seconds.  Actually had some envious looks from other teams that were WAY more experienced than us, but just using unmodified cans. 

So, thanks a ton.  We did NOT have fuel jug envy.

Cheers,

Dave