Re: Tires

Since this is resurrected let me make a comment about the Federal 595 tires I've run on my class C fwd cars in 14" and 15"...

Hate them. But they come in the small overall diameter I need to look for sometimes.

the extreme chevron tread pattern and probably something to do with my crappy driving, crappy cars, and crappy suspension non-setup has them feathering badly. Most recently I've been running them on the low hp Hyundai Accent that has camber bolts maxed out up front and all 4 wheels will feather the outside edge with the outside front tire getting the most. When we were going for a Class C win and doing full tank stints with 3 experienced-ish drivers at Thunderhill, we had to flip on the rim and rotate the tires after Saturday and by end of Sunday the tires were through the "traction layer" of rubber (meaning cords were not very far off).

https://www.tires-easy.com/medias/sys_master/images/images/hd5/h44/9123117203486/federal-ss-595-055-tiresDetailsFormat.jpg

As for traction / grip? They are predictable and certainly better than the tires that came on the cars when I bought them. If the tread pattern were different, I'd be much happier with them I think. It's just tough for me to swallow that rate of tire consumption on a 2300 lb 100ish hp car.

Re: Tires

Those look like a regular everyday tire. What is the treadwear? I'd think you'd want to be as close to 200 as you can get.

"get up and get your grandma outta here"

Re: Tires

Mr.Yuck wrote:

Those look like a regular everyday tire. What is the treadwear? I'd think you'd want to be as close to 200 as you can get.

240.  I am taking a gamble on them since there is Lemons provenance with Chris Overzet using them on some of his Class C builds.

Re: Tires

OnkelUdo wrote:
Mr.Yuck wrote:

Those look like a regular everyday tire. What is the treadwear? I'd think you'd want to be as close to 200 as you can get.

240.  I am taking a gamble on them since there is Lemons provenance with Chris Overzet using them on some of his Class C builds.

Yea, I used them on the recommendation of Overzet as well. They drive fine. They wear horribly. They might need a bunch of castor or camber or  something. they chunk and scallop badly for me.

Re: Tires

tires and brakes you don't want to skimp on. We run Falken's now but had good luck with Dunlop Dzairez's. They wear very well and are predictable. We have them as our spare set. Of course we run a heavy Firebrid with a strong 305....

"get up and get your grandma outta here"

31 (edited by OnkelUdo 2021-03-18 08:50 AM)

Re: Tires

Mr.Yuck wrote:

tires and brakes you don't want to skimp on. We run Falken's now but had good luck with Dunlop Dzairez's. They wear very well and are predictable. We have them as our spare set. Of course we run a heavy Firebrid with a strong 305....

In general I agree but on our IoE contenders, we often skimp on tires.  The is a 4th gen Camero with 90 hp 700# engine and 3-speed manual in it.  ANYTHING is an upgrade to the ancient, mismatched all season ties that were on it the first race.  Top speed was 70 mph.

Re: Tires

Spank wrote:
OnkelUdo wrote:
Mr.Yuck wrote:

Those look like a regular everyday tire. What is the treadwear? I'd think you'd want to be as close to 200 as you can get.

240.  I am taking a gamble on them since there is Lemons provenance with Chris Overzet using them on some of his Class C builds.

Yea, I used them on the recommendation of Overzet as well. They drive fine. They wear horribly. They might need a bunch of castor or camber or  something. they chunk and scallop badly for me.

Those tires were way better than 30 year old snow tires...

Team whatever_racecar #745 Volvo wagon

Re: Tires

OnkelUdo wrote:
Mr.Yuck wrote:

tires and brakes you don't want to skimp on. We run Falken's now but had good luck with Dunlop Dzairez's. They wear very well and are predictable. We have them as our spare set. Of course we run a heavy Firebrid with a strong 305....

In general I agree but on our IoE contenders, we often skimp on tires.  The is a 4th gen Camero with 90 hp 700# engine and 3-speed manual in it.  ANYTHING is an upgrade to the ancient, mismatched all season ties that were on it the first race.  Top speed was 70 mph.

we are not interested in IoE...just racing. Terrible tires are dangerous for the racer and the cars around them. At 70 it might not seem like a problem, but our driver broke our car at about 75-80 when the tail end came around and he hit the rail.  The car was unfixable. I'd at least use something almost sporty.

"get up and get your grandma outta here"

Re: Tires

"we are not interested in IoE...just racing. "

And that is where we have a fundemental disconnect.  Racing an IoE car, with all its limitations, the way it has to be raced is the most important point.

"Terrible tires are dangerous for the racer and the cars around them."

To my point above, not if you drive it on the track like you have terrible tires.

If your goal is maximum racing prowess, yes the best RE71/Direzza/Azenis/other 200 UTQ tire is the awnser.  Not having those does not make your car dangerous unless you continue to act like you have that level of equipment.  The meatbag behind the wheel determines the how safe you can race with the equipment you are racing with.  Lemons giving us the freedom to make that choice is why we do build IoE/Class C cars as well as racing our fast car...because that is as much or more fun for us than the competative car we also field.

Re: Tires

OnkelUdo wrote:

"we are not interested in IoE...just racing. "

And that is where we have a fundemental disconnect.  Racing an IoE car, with all its limitations, the way it has to be raced is the most important point.

"Terrible tires are dangerous for the racer and the cars around them."

To my point above, not if you drive it on the track like you have terrible tires.

If your goal is maximum racing prowess, yes the best RE71/Direzza/Azenis/other 200 UTQ tire is the awnser.  Not having those does not make your car dangerous unless you continue to act like you have that level of equipment.  The meatbag behind the wheel determines the how safe you can race with the equipment you are racing with.  Lemons giving us the freedom to make that choice is why we do build IoE/Class C cars as well as racing our fast car...because that is as much or more fun for us than the competative car we also field.

https://image.vietnamnews.vn//uploadvnnews/Article/2019/2/22/like7723540PM.jpg

Re: Tires

Spank wrote:
OnkelUdo wrote:

"we are not interested in IoE...just racing. "

And that is where we have a fundemental disconnect.  Racing an IoE car, with all its limitations, the way it has to be raced is the most important point.

"Terrible tires are dangerous for the racer and the cars around them."

To my point above, not if you drive it on the track like you have terrible tires.

If your goal is maximum racing prowess, yes the best RE71/Direzza/Azenis/other 200 UTQ tire is the awnser.  Not having those does not make your car dangerous unless you continue to act like you have that level of equipment.  The meatbag behind the wheel determines the how safe you can race with the equipment you are racing with.  Lemons giving us the freedom to make that choice is why we do build IoE/Class C cars as well as racing our fast car...because that is as much or more fun for us than the competative car we also field.

https://image.vietnamnews.vn//uploadvnnews/Article/2019/2/22/like7723540PM.jpg


"Drive the Car you have, not the car you want it to be" --Spank 2009

Re: Tires

Spank wrote:
Spank wrote:
OnkelUdo wrote:

"we are not interested in IoE...just racing. "

And that is where we have a fundemental disconnect.  Racing an IoE car, with all its limitations, the way it has to be raced is the most important point.

"Terrible tires are dangerous for the racer and the cars around them."

To my point above, not if you drive it on the track like you have terrible tires.

If your goal is maximum racing prowess, yes the best RE71/Direzza/Azenis/other 200 UTQ tire is the awnser.  Not having those does not make your car dangerous unless you continue to act like you have that level of equipment.  The meatbag behind the wheel determines the how safe you can race with the equipment you are racing with.  Lemons giving us the freedom to make that choice is why we do build IoE/Class C cars as well as racing our fast car...because that is as much or more fun for us than the competative car we also field.

https://image.vietnamnews.vn//uploadvnnews/Article/2019/2/22/like7723540PM.jpg


"Drive the Car you have, not the car you want it to be" --Spank 2009

I use this line in the Penalty Box a lot along with "Drive the car you have not the car you had." There's regularly surprise about a car whose driving characteristics change as you drive it harder than it was designed for over 10/30/60/90/180 minutes. Turns out that even if you run the stickiest tires, you still have to be intelligent about how you apply them. Blaming the tires doesn't get you very far, FWIW.

Eric Rood
Everything Bagel, 24 Hours of Lemons
eric@24hoursoflemons.com

38 (edited by Spank 2021-03-19 09:45 AM)

Re: Tires

I modified it a little when I was talking to Leno after he complained incessantly about the tires on the Hyundai. I told him "Drive the car you have, not the car you WISH you had." The Yokohama guys were at Sonoma and to their credit before the green flag dropped they came over and asked me what size I was running and they said they wish they could help but they didn't have anything in 13".

This, btw, is my absolute FAVORITE penalty of all time.

http://www.myrideisme.com/Blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/24-hours-of-Lemons-Racing-15.jpg

Re: Tires

The mere threat of that penalty is enough to get people to realize tires aren't the problem.

Edit to add image:

https://i.imgur.com/hfDcLV9.jpg

Eric Rood
Everything Bagel, 24 Hours of Lemons
eric@24hoursoflemons.com

Re: Tires

therood wrote:

The mere threat of that penalty is enough to get people to realize tires aren't the problem.

Edit to add image:

https://i.imgur.com/hfDcLV9.jpg

And Eric, Did the Esteem or the Plymero incure ANY real black flags (the driving too slow for the Plymero does not count)?  If they did, was any related to a driver unable to control the vehicle at the speed raced with 7+ year old mismatched all-season tires?