Topic: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

The resourceful LeMonster reaches for what he has in abundance to help keep things cool.

http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f95/vstroud66/Lemons/img_0534.jpg

2 (edited by Riktor 2009-08-06 07:56 PM)

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

Nioce...

but the Most interesting man in the WORLD does not approve...

http://i4.ytimg.com/vi/k-aoECXBrEI/hqdefault.jpg

Sons of STIG
Judge Jonny, "So, what's the next formerly thought to be immune from winning that will steal the nickels?An MR2? A Fierro (ha ha ha)? A Datsun/Nissan Z? A Camaro?"

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

Needs more duct tape.

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

I like the placement of the tecate can. smile

Team Magnum PI ness  #357  -

106th place at Nelson Ledges - The Lamest Days
-oil pressure failure leading to engine failure

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

if you're really worried about it, lose the electric fan, bolt up a straight metal fan, and put back on the stock shroud.  People underestimate the effectiveness of that little piece of plastic, and overestimate the usefulness of an electric fan zip tied to the middle of the radiator with no shroud.  if that's not a 2.0l four banger in there (it's not, I know) that fan spells death.

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

You cannot beat the effectiveness of a well shrouded mechanical fan any day of the week.  Electric ones suck.

"Sharp as Bear Claws and Slicker Than Goose Shit"
Lab Rats Motorsports
1990 VW Jetta
Charlotte, NC

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

cpmskinny wrote:

Electric ones suck.

...or blow depending on which side of the radiator it's on.

--Rob Leone Schumacher Taxi Service
We won the IOE at Southern Discomfort.
We got screwed at The Real Hoopties of New Jersey  and we took cars down with us.
We got the curse at Capitol Offense but they wouldn't let us destroy the car.

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

The shroud is important as hell the perfect setup is a full shroud with w tight fit at the fan blades, extending to the centerline of the blades ...and think about how the under hood air escapes the engine compartment....the base of the windshield is a high pressure area and won't exhaust the air....took us 60 laps in the pits at Reno to solve that problem...if you're using an electric fan, make it pull, not push. and CLEAN the damn rad tubes...incredible how many rads I've seen where the fine dust and dirt clogs the fins...hose it out from behind....separating the auto trans cooler from the engine rad also helps a lot....and think about trapped air. Hondas are notorious for this. The bleed is there for a reason

Jim "Endo" Anderton
30 years of racing and still not Brambilla.....

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

jimeditorial wrote:

and CLEAN the damn rad tubes...incredible how many rads I've seen where the fine dust and dirt clogs the fins...hose it out from behind....separating the auto trans cooler from the engine rad also helps a lot....

Agreed.  We removed ours, flushed the inside, then cleaned the fins with a pressure washer.  I was surprised how much crap was in there.  As for the auto trans...no 'race car' should have and auto trans...EVAR. smile 

About the trapped air, if that is the case the car will overheat in two laps.  Trapped air in a cooling system is the devil for sure.

I disagree on the electric fan vs. mechanical one though.  Of course any fan needs a proper shroud to work as designed , but a modern electric fan flows a ton of CFM, and if you get one (or two) properly sized for the car they work just fine.  We removed the mechanical fan from our E30 last year and used an electric one instead.  The car never saw more than 220 degrees the whole race.

One more tip/trick is to run distilled water since we can't use additives like Water wetter.  Distilled water has a higher boiling point due to the lack of impurities.

Captain
Team Super Westerfield Bros.
'93 Acura Integra - No VTEC Yo!

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

honestly i think that to keep these third gens cool you have to introduce more air to the rad. These cars have a nose that covers the entire frontage of the rad, and your not getting much help from the car moving through the air. My team noticed that in open air we would be around 220* but as soon as you were behind someone and they were blocking the airflow the needle would spike.... Im not saying you do this

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47b9d627b3127ccec799b5853bac00000010O00QbN2zhyycMge3nwM/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D550/ry%3D400/

  but this solved our problem and the car does not move from 200*. after consideration had i have to do this again i would have used a 3" hole saw and not the sawzall but nid race what are you gonna do?

Chuck

No Budget Racing
Chief Instigator
1991 Ponticrap OnFirebird
Racing a Camaro/Firebird at Lemons is a box full of fail, thats why we do it.

11 (edited by VKZ24 2009-08-07 11:13 AM)

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

Voice Of Reason wrote:

honestly i think that to keep these third gens cool you have to introduce more air to the rad. These cars have a nose that covers the entire frontage of the rad, and your not getting much help from the car moving through the air.

Not trying to a smart a$$ Chuck, but you are aware that car (and most GM cars) is designed as a bottom feeder right?  I run a Z-24 on track (often) and my 'radiator openings' are pretty much these tiny two ares beside the fog lights seen here:

Link

The lower air dam (which I think I see in your pic) is designed as low pressure zone to 'suck' air up into/thru the radiator.  GM uses this same design on the Corvette and most of it's other cars and it works just fine.

I'm not saying your idea won't work (obviously it did for you), I'm just saying the car's cooling system wasn't designed for air to be directly feed into the radiator via the bumper area openings.

Captain
Team Super Westerfield Bros.
'93 Acura Integra - No VTEC Yo!

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

i completely agree with you on airflow through the bottom design. My point is that for a car driven on the road not seeing more then say 3k rpm on a sustained basis that works fine. Now throw in the fact that you are pegged at or near the red line for 10 hours, with cars blocking that oh so precious clean cool air and you have a problem. which we found. your only choice is to introduce more air to help with overheating in the draft. i don't think that any amount of additional fans, or duct tape is going to help when you are in a vacuum situation behind another car at 60 mph 

I would either cut the holes or make a huge sheet metal duct that was hanging down below the nose to introduce more air. 

Chuck

No Budget Racing
Chief Instigator
1991 Ponticrap OnFirebird
Racing a Camaro/Firebird at Lemons is a box full of fail, thats why we do it.

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

RobL wrote:
cpmskinny wrote:

Electric ones suck.

...or blow depending on which side of the radiator it's on.

Touche

"Sharp as Bear Claws and Slicker Than Goose Shit"
Lab Rats Motorsports
1990 VW Jetta
Charlotte, NC

14 (edited by Riktor 2009-08-07 11:46 AM)

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

Hood and bumper alteration like so can be made for around $20 in sheet metal.

http://fiero.cc/fiero-tdc/members/mws/FieroPix/FieroNose/fiero14.jpg

Sons of STIG
Judge Jonny, "So, what's the next formerly thought to be immune from winning that will steal the nickels?An MR2? A Fierro (ha ha ha)? A Datsun/Nissan Z? A Camaro?"

15 (edited by VKZ24 2009-08-07 12:15 PM)

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

Riktor wrote:

Hood and bumper alteration like so can be made for around $20 in sheet metal.

Which is kind of what we did with a return air vent from Home Depot Racing....

http://i164.photobucket.com/albums/u9/VKZ24/P1010642.jpg

Captain
Team Super Westerfield Bros.
'93 Acura Integra - No VTEC Yo!

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

of course you can make it pretty like the guys above... i subscribe to the function before style mag tho...

No Budget Racing
Chief Instigator
1991 Ponticrap OnFirebird
Racing a Camaro/Firebird at Lemons is a box full of fail, thats why we do it.

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

Voice Of Reason wrote:

of course you can make it pretty like the guys above... i subscribe to the function before style mag tho...

Are you saying our aren't functional?  For $18 we'll take whatever style/function we can get.

Captain
Team Super Westerfield Bros.
'93 Acura Integra - No VTEC Yo!

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

i think total we made the chicken coop for about 10 bucks. i never said it wasn't functional.. i just said it was pretty. lol

No Budget Racing
Chief Instigator
1991 Ponticrap OnFirebird
Racing a Camaro/Firebird at Lemons is a box full of fail, thats why we do it.

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

VKZ24 wrote:
jimeditorial wrote:

and CLEAN the damn rad tubes...incredible how many rads I've seen where the fine dust and dirt clogs the fins...hose it out from behind....separating the auto trans cooler from the engine rad also helps a lot....

One more tip/trick is to run distilled water since we can't use additives like Water wetter.  Distilled water has a higher boiling point due to the lack of impurities.

Actually impurities raise the boiling point of any pure solvent.

I don't think distilled water would be distilled water for long after you pour it into an old cooling system full miscellaneous crud. 

Your best bet for raising the boiling point is higher system pressure.

And just in case someone is wondering, de-ionized water is a really bad idea.  It's corrosive.

Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

RichVS wrote:

And just in case someone is wondering, de-ionized water is a really bad idea.  It's corrosive.

That is funny considering we use it exclusively with isopropyl alchohol, here at work because of its properties. Granted we only use ot for washing parts before electrically bonding them or applying paint.

Sons of STIG
Judge Jonny, "So, what's the next formerly thought to be immune from winning that will steal the nickels?An MR2? A Fierro (ha ha ha)? A Datsun/Nissan Z? A Camaro?"

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

Thanks for the comments guys. I'm well aware that it needs a fan shroud, and it will have one. The mech fan vs. electric fan argument was solved for me with the motor that was in the car when I bought it - it had the Gen II LT1 motor, no provision to run a mechanical fan. It is not as small of a fan as you may think. The purpose of the post was just to show that beer cans have multiple uses...

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

ecniv wrote:

Thanks for the comments guys. I'm well aware that it needs a fan shroud, and it will have one. The mech fan vs. electric fan argument was solved for me with the motor that was in the car when I bought it - it had the Gen II LT1 motor, no provision to run a mechanical fan. It is not as small of a fan as you may think. The purpose of the post was just to show that beer cans have multiple uses...

Indeed - the packaging is almost as useful as what comes inside.

Proudly pissing off Pick 'n Pull employees since 1991
Team The Homer

1981 Ford Fairmont Durango

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

ecniv wrote:

Thanks for the comments guys. I'm well aware that it needs a fan shroud, and it will have one. The mech fan vs. electric fan argument was solved for me with the motor that was in the car when I bought it - it had the Gen II LT1 motor, no provision to run a mechanical fan. It is not as small of a fan as you may think. The purpose of the post was just to show that beer cans have multiple uses...

That they do... Should have thrown a Guiness can in there some where... just ot throw people off.


So uh... How has that LT1 worked our for you? Is your intake still like a opera singer sucking through a coffee straw?

Sons of STIG
Judge Jonny, "So, what's the next formerly thought to be immune from winning that will steal the nickels?An MR2? A Fierro (ha ha ha)? A Datsun/Nissan Z? A Camaro?"

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

LT1 blew up in the Reno race. Sold it and the Painless Wiring conversion harness that was in the car for $400, went with a traditional small block.

Re: Running a vehicle with an engine notorious for overheating?

ecniv wrote:

LT1 blew up in the Reno race. Sold it and the Painless Wiring conversion harness that was in the car for $400, went with a traditional small block.

http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2007/07/excellent.jpg

Sons of STIG
Judge Jonny, "So, what's the next formerly thought to be immune from winning that will steal the nickels?An MR2? A Fierro (ha ha ha)? A Datsun/Nissan Z? A Camaro?"