1 (edited by Speedycop 2011-04-21 03:50 AM)

Topic: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

Anybody who can lend a hand on Fridays/Saturdays,  PLEASE let me know. I have no real rotary knowledge yet. I'm not skilled in fiberglass work, either. Even if it's just a static display, I plan to bring it to Summit Point. I'd prefer that it be used as a pace car, so that means getting it running again (it lost spark) and fixing the frozen-from-sitting-for-decades brakes.

I'm in Brandywine, MD, about 15 minutes outside the DC beltway. Email me at speedycop at com cast dot net if you can lend a hand!

Captain: Speedycop & The Gang Of Outlaws -'94 Mark VIII (Least Horrible Yank Tank Stafford '09, NOLA '10) '61 Caddy (Org Choice-NL '09) '63 Tbird (EPIC Repair Failure-Gingerman '10, I Got Screwed-Summit Pt '10, I.O.E. WINNER Stafford '10!) '77 Lancia Scorpion (I.O.E. WINNER Joliet 2010!) '67 Galaxie 500 (Judges Choice-CMP '11)
Future Fleet: 1957 Ford Prefect 1942 Buick 1959 Bugeye Project GLCOAT

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

What kind of fiberglass work do you need to do?  Unfortunately I'll be overseas most of the time from now till Summit but maybe I can provide some tips or something.

http://wartburg.misfittoysracing.com
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Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

Mostly detail work, filling in uneven/unfinished areas. I need to remount the door skins, figure out a strut system to help raise the heavy frames, figure out hood/trunk/door latches, paint it, etc. It really needs a proper set of like 16" alloy wheels to get rid of these ugly 13" steelies and snow tires, but my credit card is about maxed.

Captain: Speedycop & The Gang Of Outlaws -'94 Mark VIII (Least Horrible Yank Tank Stafford '09, NOLA '10) '61 Caddy (Org Choice-NL '09) '63 Tbird (EPIC Repair Failure-Gingerman '10, I Got Screwed-Summit Pt '10, I.O.E. WINNER Stafford '10!) '77 Lancia Scorpion (I.O.E. WINNER Joliet 2010!) '67 Galaxie 500 (Judges Choice-CMP '11)
Future Fleet: 1957 Ford Prefect 1942 Buick 1959 Bugeye Project GLCOAT

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

it lost spark

Is it running with just the stock distributors, or does it have aftermarket ignition boxes plugged in? Did you lose ALL spark, or just on the leading or trailing plugs (leading plugs are on bottom, trailing are on top)? On one or both engines?

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

Lost all spark on both 12a's. The ignition is a 4 MSD box system (one per plug) working off a custom crank trigger. Everything looks good and seems to have juice, but I only get an actual spark when I turn the ignition switch on or off. Makes for a nice BOOM after cranking it without spark for a while.

Captain: Speedycop & The Gang Of Outlaws -'94 Mark VIII (Least Horrible Yank Tank Stafford '09, NOLA '10) '61 Caddy (Org Choice-NL '09) '63 Tbird (EPIC Repair Failure-Gingerman '10, I Got Screwed-Summit Pt '10, I.O.E. WINNER Stafford '10!) '77 Lancia Scorpion (I.O.E. WINNER Joliet 2010!) '67 Galaxie 500 (Judges Choice-CMP '11)
Future Fleet: 1957 Ford Prefect 1942 Buick 1959 Bugeye Project GLCOAT

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

Sounds like a wiring problem inside the car.  If it ran before, but doesn't now - something got dislodged or cut during the chaos.

Some basic troubleshooting with a DVM will help, or bypass the wiring in the car and jumper the MSD directly to the battery to isolate where the problem lies.

If you've got cranking spark when jumpered, problem is inside the car - if not, problem is in the msd/trigger setup.  Clamp-off fuel lines, or disable fuel pump to avoid surprising your neighbors during this process.

"Chief Idiot" - Italian Stallions Rotary X1/9
Class Win (Bad) / IOE Win (Guzzi Fiat 600) / We Got Screwed / GRM Most from Least

7 (edited by pennintj 2011-04-27 07:50 AM)

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

Speedycop wrote:

Lost all spark on both 12a's. The ignition is a 4 MSD box system (one per plug) working off a custom crank trigger. Everything looks good and seems to have juice, but I only get an actual spark when I turn the ignition switch on or off. Makes for a nice BOOM after cranking it without spark for a while.

It's only firing when you're turning the key it's (more than likely) a problem with the sensor(s) it/themselves, or in the sensor circuit. Since it's effectively grounding through the ignition switch.

Check the sensors on the distributors for intermittent continuity. I assume it's a hall-effect setup & not a points/condensor arrangement?

Also, check your ground between the frame, engine(s), and battery to see if it's loose.

-=Tom

-=HFC Tom

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

Speedycop wrote:

...needs a proper set of like 16" alloy wheels to get rid of these ugly 13" steelies and snow tires, but my credit card is about maxed.

what's the bolt pattern?

FastISH and the FURRiest 1991 Volvo 240 wagon
WV 13th, FL 8th (GRM), NJ 8th (B win), WV 4th (B win), NC 14th, NJ 14th, WV 62nd,  NH 17th, NY 54th
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Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

I gotta double check, but it's 4 lug. I'm guessing 4x100, or 4x4. I will let you know. A tire/wheel sponsor would get a lotta mileage out of a banner on this thing...

Captain: Speedycop & The Gang Of Outlaws -'94 Mark VIII (Least Horrible Yank Tank Stafford '09, NOLA '10) '61 Caddy (Org Choice-NL '09) '63 Tbird (EPIC Repair Failure-Gingerman '10, I Got Screwed-Summit Pt '10, I.O.E. WINNER Stafford '10!) '77 Lancia Scorpion (I.O.E. WINNER Joliet 2010!) '67 Galaxie 500 (Judges Choice-CMP '11)
Future Fleet: 1957 Ford Prefect 1942 Buick 1959 Bugeye Project GLCOAT

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

NOBODY wants to help wrench on the only model in existence? Summit is 2 1/2 weeks away, I want a running 8 wheeled pace car!

Captain: Speedycop & The Gang Of Outlaws -'94 Mark VIII (Least Horrible Yank Tank Stafford '09, NOLA '10) '61 Caddy (Org Choice-NL '09) '63 Tbird (EPIC Repair Failure-Gingerman '10, I Got Screwed-Summit Pt '10, I.O.E. WINNER Stafford '10!) '77 Lancia Scorpion (I.O.E. WINNER Joliet 2010!) '67 Galaxie 500 (Judges Choice-CMP '11)
Future Fleet: 1957 Ford Prefect 1942 Buick 1959 Bugeye Project GLCOAT

11 (edited by EriktheAwful 2011-05-30 06:06 AM)

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

I want to, but I'm half a continent away and I already have too much to do on my Jaguar.

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

Speedycop wrote:

NOBODY wants to help wrench on the only model in existence? Summit is 2 1/2 weeks away, I want a running 8 wheeled pace car!

If I wasn't frantically trying to get my 1st Gen DSM together for Summit, I'd love to help.  Looking forward to seeing the beast!

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

Just saw this, you get it running yet?  one of our guys knows rotarys pretty well and can fix just about anything, but we are still way behind trying to get our 190 ready for summit too.  Give me a shout if you are still stuck

Now happily part of Speedycop.

formerly:
Ziegel Scheißhaus Racing & ReVolvolution Racing

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

I have the crack Sputnick team (of Stanza wagon fame) on the case. They are ordering up crank trigger wheels and assorted bits to make a new trigger. These guys are unreal! All day Saturday and Sunday working on diagnostics, research, and scouring the junkyards. They bought parts out of their own pockets, and haven't yet taken a dime. I love these guys!

Captain: Speedycop & The Gang Of Outlaws -'94 Mark VIII (Least Horrible Yank Tank Stafford '09, NOLA '10) '61 Caddy (Org Choice-NL '09) '63 Tbird (EPIC Repair Failure-Gingerman '10, I Got Screwed-Summit Pt '10, I.O.E. WINNER Stafford '10!) '77 Lancia Scorpion (I.O.E. WINNER Joliet 2010!) '67 Galaxie 500 (Judges Choice-CMP '11)
Future Fleet: 1957 Ford Prefect 1942 Buick 1959 Bugeye Project GLCOAT

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

to my understanding 12a rotaries were horrible for flooding out if not warmed up all the way before shutting down. Then again you said it has no spark so sound like a ground off the ignition box or reference wire from the crank was lost.  This probably mean nothing but I do have a full .pdf service manual for the 1993-1995 (2002 in japan) 3rd gen rx-7 but that was a twin turbo engine dunno what major differences are between the 12a and 13b. (aside from the turbo setup...porting maybe??)

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

Totally different animals. The Sputnick guys verified it was the custom crank trigger for the 4 MSD boxes.

Captain: Speedycop & The Gang Of Outlaws -'94 Mark VIII (Least Horrible Yank Tank Stafford '09, NOLA '10) '61 Caddy (Org Choice-NL '09) '63 Tbird (EPIC Repair Failure-Gingerman '10, I Got Screwed-Summit Pt '10, I.O.E. WINNER Stafford '10!) '77 Lancia Scorpion (I.O.E. WINNER Joliet 2010!) '67 Galaxie 500 (Judges Choice-CMP '11)
Future Fleet: 1957 Ford Prefect 1942 Buick 1959 Bugeye Project GLCOAT

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

cool beans

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

GLCOAT killed Speedy's trailer. Cracked severly in several places over the axles on both frame rails. :sadpanda:

$5.00 says Speedy will try to weld it with bits and peices of roll cage tubing...

____________________________________
Always running on E \ ' ' ' ' F 
Speedycop and the Gang of Outlaws Official Ten+ Time Loser
Owner #132 Lancia/Toyota Beta/MR2 Scorpion

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

Tube frame trailer!

Driver, Pit Monkey, Rod Buster and Engine Fire Starter
Team FinalGear

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

I have the crack Sputnick team (of Stanza wagon fame) on the case. They are ordering up crank trigger wheels and assorted bits to make a new trigger.

I run my RX-7's MSD off the stock distributor. The green wires on the distributor go to the purple wires on the MSD and the purple wires on the distributor go the the green wires on the MSD. Dead nuts reliable.

to my understanding 12a rotaries were horrible for flooding out if not warmed up all the way before shutting down.

6port 13Bs were horrible for flooding out. 12As weren't as bad, but when they get high miles on them the apex seals get carboned up and you lose compression. Bumpstarting over 25mph in 2nd gear will get it fired up whether it's flooding or stuck seals, but I'm not sure how well that will work with two engines.

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

EriktheAwful wrote:

I have the crack Sputnick team (of Stanza wagon fame) on the case. They are ordering up crank trigger wheels and assorted bits to make a new trigger.

I run my RX-7's MSD off the stock distributor. The green wires on the distributor go to the purple wires on the MSD and the purple wires on the distributor go the the green wires on the MSD. Dead nuts reliable.

to my understanding 12a rotaries were horrible for flooding out if not warmed up all the way before shutting down.

6port 13Bs were horrible for flooding out. 12As weren't as bad, but when they get high miles on them the apex seals get carboned up and you lose compression. Bumpstarting over 25mph in 2nd gear will get it fired up whether it's flooding or stuck seals, but I'm not sure how well that will work with two engines.

25 x 2 = 50 mph?

Silent But Deadly Racing- Chief cook and bottle washer, Former Flyin Turd Race Team Captain 
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Besmirching race tracks in the Eastern US since 2001

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

EriktheAwful wrote:

I run my RX-7's MSD off the stock distributor. The green wires on the distributor go to the purple wires on the MSD and the purple wires on the distributor go the the green wires on the MSD. Dead nuts reliable.

I wanted to do that at first but the distributor holes are either welded shut or plugged up with some sort of very hard goop. We tried to fire an EDIS-based ignition on Thursday night but it seems like EDIS wasn't picking up the trigger wheel signal, and I didn't try to investigate further yet.

K Car Stalker

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

If nothing else you can replace the front covers on the engines. Just be sure not to drop the thrust bearing behind the front pulley when you reinstall. Holding the clutch pedal down helps, but I don't remember exactly how it stacks and if it's a problem when you're going that deep.

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

Both front covers have other modifications to them (water piping, at least), and the second "front cover" is actually the center section that joins the two motors. If I had the skills to replicate those I'd have a 4-rotor engine myself big_smile

K Car Stalker

Re: HELP NEEDED getting this thing ready for Summit Point!

There shouldn't be any water piping in the front cover. The water pump housing is a separate piece. Maybe an oil return line? My half-bridge was previously turbocharged and had an oil return plumbed to it.