Drivers Stint: How long in the thick of it? (Page 1 of 2)

This is what I posted in the other thread:

Two hours for the experienced (not just Lemons but with NASA and/or SCCA enduros) teams is typical.  You may only get one or two turns in the car depending on the number of drivers and length of the race.

If it's your first time in a race car, half hour to 45 minute stints should be the norm.

The first time I came out of a racecar after only 30 minutes, I was completely exhausted and useless for about an hour afterwards. 

On the Lemons side of things, you may want to rotate drivers through a little more quickly to make sure everyone gets a turn behind the wheel.  Anything can happen on track.  In SC this year, one of our cars rolled before two of the drivers had a chance to drive.  Luckily, we had multiple cars there and they hopped in for a stint in another car.  So you are going to want to run shorter stints anyway.

Unless you actually believe that you have a valid shot of winning, and trust me you don't, then you shouldn't subject your drivers to professional levels of racing seat time.

FYI, our team had a driver not want back in the car after their first stint.  I don't know how often that happens but the car wasn't 100% and they were apprehensive about going back on track in it.  You must let every driver know they can get out of the car at any time.  Muchismo be damned, you don't want someone on track who thinks they can't handle it.

Our longest stint we have done is 2 and a half hours for a driver, but that is pretty brutal.  I'd think trying to go 5 hours on Sunday in Reno would be a little dangerous, it's going to be really hot out there.  What we have run into is the drivers get fatigued and dehydrated before they realize it then they make a mistake.  Our goal is to do 2 hour stints at the Reno race but it really depends on how hot it is.  At Toledo last year the longest we could do was an hour and a half because it was so hot and humid.

Want to put a disclaimer in here, if you are new I do NOT suggest trying to do that long of a stint.  It can be very dangerous if you have never raced before.  If it is your first time out I would not go for more than an hour.  If this is your first Lemons race you probably won't have a chance to win.

At AMP last year, the winning car had two pit stops.  Once on Saturday, and once on Sunday.  Then at T'hill the same crew (the Kriders) showed up with a 32 gallon gas tank.  But since they had a 1200 lap penalty  it really didn't matter.  They did put in a ton of laps though.
Our first race was at AMP with a real POS.  The temperature was in the 90's and we had 6 drivers, all new to Lemons.  Thinking the POS wouldn't last in the heat, we decided on 20 minute stints.  Sure enough, after everyone had their first stint the sucker died.  Amen.
Then at t'hill, we left our rookie out too long and he did poo poo (crashed).
Good Luck!

Camelback is a good idea even for 30 minute stints.
Few few drivers are already a little worried after watching some of the videos so who knows what will happen. Hell, I was nervous at my first autoX event and thats just a bunch of cones! A lap or tw omight calm there nerves...or make them worse. I guess time will tell all of that.
Not sure what the temperatures will be like at the NE event this year but just sitting is a car with a suit on is hot.

We strongly recommend capping your stints at one hour for all of the reasons mentioned above, but we haven't made it into a rule because A) we can't really enforce it, and B) there are guys who are qualified/conditioned to go longer. Where we run into trouble is dudes that push themselves too hard without knowing it--being honest with yourself ahead of time goes a long way. And, as a partial threat, if we start to see serious safety problems stemming from too-long stints, we WILL find a way to enforce stint limits. So police yourself--but make sure you don't screw it up for everyone else.

I'll be a rookie at Fernley (although not a rookie at motorsports) and I'm wondering how you experienced hot weather guys stay hydrated...I'm thinking of a sports bottle with with a flexi straw in a holder above the shifter...where I'm from (Toronto) we generally worry about freezing in the car, not overheating! Will thin air be a factor?

We have a cup holder behind the driver with a tube that goes over the drivers shoulder, kinda sorta but not really a camel back system.  It allows the driver to take the tube and drink from it during the race.  Saying that it is hard to take a drink unless under yellow.  I drove for over an hour at Toledo and couldn't take a drink because they wouldn't throw any yellows!  Hard to go through the banked turn and drink and not crash at the same time.

I think a lot depends on the track and number of cars running.  For example, my one stint in SC this year was 45 minutes, and came at the end on Saturday.  It seemed easy compared to an early race 45 minute stint at Stafford.  If there are longish straights to relax, reflex your hands, adjust your feet to avoid that cramp, etc, then longer stints are much easier. 

This Stafford the track will be FULL of cars, and it will be HOT (middle of July).  We will start looking for cautions maybe around the 40 minute mark and adsolutely change drivers at the one hour point.  And we will be exhausted getting out of the car.

Thanks everyone for all the replies. Going to help us when the time comes for sure.

We are working on these issues ourselves preparing for New Orleans.  I figure it's going to be the hottest Lemons race to date.  June on the Gulf Coast in a swamp land.  We will probably be chewing the air we breath.

Before I get to coping with the heat, I'll comment on the driving stints.  We have tried to go for 2 hours stints and it's hasn't worked yet.  It's a long time.  I don't event think we have the fuel capacity to go much over 1 1/2 hours anyway. 

That's about as long as my friends ran in the Nasa enduro back in April.  The weather was cool and we were still sweating in our gear just sitting around in the pits.

For newbies, short stints are a better idea.  It will give everyone a better chance to drive.  However, your black flags will probably force driver changes faster than you plan anyway.

In our first Lemons race in October 08, we had frequent meetings with the honorable judges.  Nothing major but we were there.  One driver only did two very short stints and he had had enough. 

You get a very clear and sudden realization when you get on track under green, I REALLY COULD DIE!!!!  The beauty and pain of Lemons is that all driver's are welcome. 

If you're new, remember that the guy about to rear end you, side swipe you or cut you off are all probably as new and inexperienced as you are.  So while you are cursing the guy that just cut you off, the guy behind you is probably saying the same thing about you. 

After doing it a bit I realize how much you learn from the experience.  You will reflect back on your race and things will start to become clearer.  You probably won't get it at first, patience kinda has to grow on you. 

Waiting 20 seconds or even a few laps for a pass is way quicker than a botched pass with a 30 minute penalty.  Sure it's not your fault and you're Mario Andretti's long lost illegitimate child, here's your penalty.

Staying cool:

We are working on cool suits and we need a lot of capacity, most of those systems are designed for 20 minute sprint races and only last about 45 minutes tops.  I am working on a larger capacity system to help get more time out of it but it's like driving on a battery, it's going away the whole time.  I just bought a freakin' deep freeze to take so we can make ice too since I think the track may run out.

I run a lawn maintenance company in Houston, we need two bags of ice to keep ice water in our 5 gallon cooler all day without opening it much at all.  So how much will we burn in 1 1/2 to 2 hours running it out of our cooler, around our bodies and back into the cooler, I don't know but I expect a lot. 

I figure we will need more than a dozen bags of ice a day just for our coolers at the track.  I think they charge about $3.00 a bag too.  For the cool system, I hope to freeze something like 2 liter bottles and change them out during fueling.  Way quicker than draining off the excess water and adding more ice. 

Block ice will also last longer for a cool system than cubed.

In New Orleans, they have 8x8x12 blocks for their slush machine.  If you think you will need a lot, I suggest you pre-order. 

Without ice, a cool system is worthless.

Aside from the cool system, we plan to arrange personal water coolers with tubes to take a drink while driving.

I pondered that as well, but then I saw a rule that required having the windows rolled down. However, that may have been a track rule not a Lemons rule.