• From: Los Fucking Angeles
  • Registered: 2009-04-30
  • Posts: 1,032

Re: New to racing

ifb_mole will never learn.

First of all, you're claiming you kicked people off your team.

Your ex-team members are claiming they quit because of a certain team leader's behavior (i.e. YOURS).

Second of all, how much "structurred on-track instruction" did your black flag collecting team members have prior to getting thrown out of the race?

The best advice for three kids driving a Chrysler New Yorker is worry about a good theme.

And yes, your advice is hella unsound as Lemons is not about winning.

"This is the scene where I get shot," Bronson said. "I have these little squibs that explode to make it look like bullets are hitting." "Fascinating," said Bergman. "I never knew how they did that." "You mean," asked Bronson, "you don't use machine guns in your movies?"
  • From: Toronto, Ontario
  • Registered: 2009-05-03
  • Posts: 1,114

Re: New to racing

I'd advise finding a comfortable speed, stick to it and watch how the "experts" do it....by staying out of the way of the Sennas out there you have a good chance of beating a number of fast teams....wanna beat a Porsche/Mustang/Miata etc. with a New Yorker? Drive to survive and you can. I drove my heart out in Reno last year and we got beaten by a Chrysler minivan.....sometimes slow can be fast...

Jim "Endo" Anderton
30 years of racing and still not Brambilla.....

28 Reply by ifb_mole (edited by ifb_mole 2010-02-14 04:37 PM)

  • Registered: 2009-09-01
  • Posts: 405

Re: New to racing

Judge Jonny wrote:

ifb_mole will never learn.

First of all, you're claiming you kicked people off your team.

Your ex-team members are claiming they quit because of a certain team leader's behavior (i.e. YOURS).

Second of all, how much "structurred on-track instruction" did your black flag collecting team members have prior to getting thrown out of the race?

The best advice for three kids driving a Chrysler New Yorker is worry about a good theme.

And yes, your advice is hella unsound as Lemons is not about winning.

I said they're not on the new team for Sears Pointless, I never said I kicked them off. 

MY behavior didn't get us booted Johnny, if anything my behavior with Jay is what allowed us to stay in when he asked me "why should I let you guys continue?" after black flag #3.  He did let us out one last time and we got black flag #4, BEFORE I even got in the car.

Yes the team did get black flag instruction but NONE were from my actions.  Jay was very good to us and gave us more slack than we probably deserved. I never denied that and Jay was very fair and reasonable considering the nature of our black flags.

Johnny my actions on the track were never an issue, EVER, so admittedly I have a big mouth and am opinionated on a web site, so what?  Was I ever a menace, dangerous or a f*%king dickhead on the track? NO, I was not.

Did I ever give advice about winning?  Lemons isn't about winning it is about having fun, but everyone wants to finish and do as well as they can, don't they?  My advise on this thread wasn't about winning at all, it was about getting seat time and track time so they can have fun and not be scared and not be a danger to the other cars/drivers.  Also if you can get some seat/track time in the Lemons car before the event, it can help you find some potential problems that you can fix to better ensure you FINISH, not WIN.

  • Registered: 2009-10-25
  • Posts: 1,993

Re: New to racing

jimeditorial wrote:

I'd advise finding a comfortable speed, stick to it and watch how the "experts" do it....by staying out of the way of the Sennas out there you have a good chance of beating a number of fast teams....wanna beat a Porsche/Mustang/Miata etc. with a New Yorker? Drive to survive and you can. I drove my heart out in Reno last year and we got beaten by a Chrysler minivan.....sometimes slow can be fast...

this is great advice....another bit of great advice I heard from a "rookie" team was that they switch drivers every hour....WHY...because they want to make sure all 6 of their drivers gets plenty of seat time....the car only needs fuel every 2 hours...but getting their drivers seat time is more important than a few less pit stops

Richard Doty
1984 Porsche 928 "Estate"
Porsche- "there is A substitute" Racing
Dirt Poorsche Racing #2
  • From: Land Of Subarus, Colorado
  • Registered: 2009-04-30
  • Posts: 9,416

Re: New to racing

The guys who have a lot of track experience are able to crash at higher speeds, and they complain more in the Penalty Box. That's the main difference between them and the total rookies.

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  • Registered: 2009-09-01
  • Posts: 405

Re: New to racing

MurileeMartin wrote:

The guys who have a lot of track experience are able to crash at higher speeds, and they complain more in the Penalty Box. That's the main difference between them and the total rookies.

sure, anyone is capable of crashing, but some, even just a little, proper instruction, seat time and track time is certainly better than NONE at all.

This thread was about a group of compete virgin never-been-in-any-motorsports-competition ever. In my opinion, it would benefit them to get proper structured instruction on the track they plan on racing on in the Lemons car. This will give them instruction, seat time, track time and an opportunity to shake down the car to see if there are any issues that need correctng before the event (ie brakes and engine cooling) that way they will be better prepared to FINISH the event. It doesn't guarantee they will finish any better than if they do no instruction and no pre Lemons testing, but it will certainly help.  It had nothing to do with winning, it had to do with making the event even more enjoyable because you will have at least some track knowledge and seat time and a better chance the car will finish because they tested it.

Generally the better prepared the cars and drivers are, the better the chances of finishing the event and having more fun. I may be stepping out on a limb here, but I dare say everyone wants to finish the race, regardless of position, just finishing and have fun doing it.

  • From: San Diego, CA
  • Registered: 2009-04-30
  • Posts: 1,640

Re: New to racing

Based on what I've seen by the OP's posts, Nick's advice is best. Make sure your team really knows what the costs involved will be.

The Homer: Powerful like a gorilla, yet soft and yielding like a Nerf ball.
  • trekkor
  • trekkor
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  • From: Napa, Ca
  • Registered: 2009-08-26
  • Posts: 2,124

Re: New to racing

If I'm at the HOD or Trackmasters events, I'll happily instruct any Lemons hopefuls.

http://www.hookedondriving.com/home.cfm

http://www.trackmasters-racing.com/


KT

TH 2009- 40th ~ SP 2010- 13th Class Bad win!! TH 2010- 17th ~TH 2010- 16th  SP 2011- 20th ~ RF 2011- 13th Least Horrible Yank Tank ~ TH 2011- 79th
SP 2011- 105th ~ SP 2012- 119th ~ SP 2013- 139th ~ BW 2013- 17th
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  • sergio
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  • Posts: 1,185

Re: New to racing

fifthavenue wrote:

Very cool. It's nice not to encounter elitists who tell people to search. We're a bit concerned about the cost of the firesuits and helmets. I saw that there's a package for about $475 per suit (with helmet, firesuit, shoes, and gloves). Is that the usual going rate? Also, there seems to be prefabbed roll cages available, but it might work better if we fabricate our own since it is an old 4-door boat. Any tips about that? And regarding exhaust, can we just hack off the cat and muffler? Does the tailpipe need to extend past the rear bumper?

We've given a car new spark plugs, oil/filter, air filter, and cap/rotor. She starts up and runs well and doesn't stall out like when we got her. She still has the problem of tackling hills (topping out at 45 MPH and losing speed going uphill; doesn't help that the kickdown prevents it from going into 3rd when floored). Is this just a characteristic of cars of this vintage? Or is there anything else that might help?

Is that $475 package a 2 layer suit? If not, then you need to get nomex underwear, that's about another $120.

I got my suit from www.raceimage.com. Used Nascar pit crew suits are pretty affordable.  Make sure they are 2 layer and that they have the SFI tags on them. Just don't look for a cheap Dale JR. team suit. The lesser known teams are cheaper.

  • From: Atlanta, GA
  • Registered: 2009-09-01
  • Posts: 561

Re: New to racing

The Lemons package is only $425 and includes everything you need to be Lemons legal. 

http://yhst-14891464457018.stores.yahoo … h-kit.html

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  • jmitch
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  • Registered: 2009-11-02
  • Posts: 154

Re: New to racing

icemang17 wrote:
jimeditorial wrote:

I'd advise finding a comfortable speed, stick to it and watch how the "experts" do it....by staying out of the way of the Sennas out there you have a good chance of beating a number of fast teams....wanna beat a Porsche/Mustang/Miata etc. with a New Yorker? Drive to survive and you can. I drove my heart out in Reno last year and we got beaten by a Chrysler minivan.....sometimes slow can be fast...

this is great advice....another bit of great advice I heard from a "rookie" team was that they switch drivers every hour....WHY...because they want to make sure all 6 of their drivers gets plenty of seat time....the car only needs fuel every 2 hours...but getting their drivers seat time is more important than a few less pit stops

Great advice! We new our car was a POS so we drove only 30 minutes each to insure all drivers got to have fun!

  • From: Toronto, Ontario
  • Registered: 2009-05-03
  • Posts: 1,114

Re: New to racing

If you Chrysler has the infamous A604 transmission, treat it like glass and do not allow wheelspin! Many have a design flaw that throws the cross shaft out of the diff right through the case if a wheel is allowed to spin, i.e. one wheel off, driving off wet grass, etc. There is a very cheap retrofit retaining tab, but you have to pull the transaxle to install it...yours may be retrofitted already. Change the fluid and filter add do add as big a cooler as you can...

Jim "Endo" Anderton
30 years of racing and still not Brambilla.....

38 Reply by Judge Jonny (edited by Judge Jonny 2010-02-15 09:31 AM)

  • From: Los Fucking Angeles
  • Registered: 2009-04-30
  • Posts: 1,032

Re: New to racing

ifb_mole wrote:
MurileeMartin wrote:

The guys who have a lot of track experience are able to crash at higher speeds, and they complain more in the Penalty Box. That's the main difference between them and the total rookies.

sure, anyone is capable of crashing, but some, even just a little, proper instruction, seat time and track time is certainly better than NONE at all.

This thread was about a group of compete virgin never-been-in-any-motorsports-competition ever. In my opinion, it would benefit them to get proper structured instruction on the track they plan on racing on in the Lemons car. This will give them instruction, seat time, track time and an opportunity to shake down the car to see if there are any issues that need correctng before the event (ie brakes and engine cooling) that way they will be better prepared to FINISH the event. It doesn't guarantee they will finish any better than if they do no instruction and no pre Lemons testing, but it will certainly help.  It had nothing to do with winning, it had to do with making the event even more enjoyable because you will have at least some track knowledge and seat time and a better chance the car will finish because they tested it.

Generally the better prepared the cars and drivers are, the better the chances of finishing the event and having more fun. I may be stepping out on a limb here, but I dare say everyone wants to finish the race, regardless of position, just finishing and have fun doing it.

I like how the guy that has never finished the event has the most advice for first timers about o how best to finish a race.

"This is the scene where I get shot," Bronson said. "I have these little squibs that explode to make it look like bullets are hitting." "Fascinating," said Bergman. "I never knew how they did that." "You mean," asked Bronson, "you don't use machine guns in your movies?"
  • Registered: 2010-02-07
  • Posts: 9

Re: New to racing

Hey guys, can you please leave the drama out of my thread and take it to PMs? kthnx





jimeditorial wrote:

If you Chrysler has the infamous A604 transmission, treat it like glass and do not allow wheelspin! Many have a design flaw that throws the cross shaft out of the diff right through the case if a wheel is allowed to spin, i.e. one wheel off, driving off wet grass, etc. There is a very cheap retrofit retaining tab, but you have to pull the transaxle to install it...yours may be retrofitted already. Change the fluid and filter add do add as big a cooler as you can...

We've got the RWD Diplomat-based Fifth Avenue. Wikipedia says it's either an A727 or A904. We can't even get wheelspin out of it even if we chained it to a tree and put bleach under the tires.

What's the average speed around the track?

  • RobL
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  • Registered: 2009-04-30
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Re: New to racing

fifthavenue wrote:

What's the average speed around the track?

The average speed is "racing speed."  Lemons aren't too far off typical racing speeds that you would encounter at a Spec Miata or ITB race.

--Rob Leone Schumacher Taxi Service
We won the IOE at Southern Discomfort.
We got screwed at The Real Hoopties of New Jersey  and we took cars down with us.
We got the curse at Capitol Offense but they wouldn't let us destroy the car.

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  • From: Toronto, Ontario
  • Registered: 2009-05-03
  • Posts: 1,114

Re: New to racing

fifthavenue wrote:

Hey guys, can you please leave the drama out of my thread and take it to PMs? kthnx





jimeditorial wrote:

If you Chrysler has the infamous A604 transmission, treat it like glass and do not allow wheelspin! Many have a design flaw that throws the cross shaft out of the diff right through the case if a wheel is allowed to spin, i.e. one wheel off, driving off wet grass, etc. There is a very cheap retrofit retaining tab, but you have to pull the transaxle to install it...yours may be retrofitted already. Change the fluid and filter add do add as big a cooler as you can...

We've got the RWD Diplomat-based Fifth Avenue. Wikipedia says it's either an A727 or A904. We can't even get wheelspin out of it even if we chained it to a tree and put bleach under the tires.

What's the average speed around the track?

A727 is bomb-proof, 904 merely bulletproof. Your trans won't be a problem...

Jim "Endo" Anderton
30 years of racing and still not Brambilla.....
  • Serj
  • Serj
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  • From: Cincinnati, OH
  • Registered: 2009-05-02
  • Posts: 1,601

Re: New to racing

it's funny you guys are running one of these. having a soft spot for rwd mopars and 318s made me consider several times trying to get one together for Lemons but the only ones i saw were well-cared for and even modified to ones that were so bad in the body/frame department I'd probably cut it in half trying to put a cage in it (blow-through's a bitch) what event are you running again? i think i missed it.

43 Reply by fifthavenue (edited by fifthavenue 2010-02-15 06:59 PM)

  • Registered: 2010-02-07
  • Posts: 9

Re: New to racing

We are aiming for "Going for Broken" but the deadline is quickly approaching. I have my sight on "Arse Sweat a Palooza" if we miss this deadline.

I never got an answer (or I missed it) about cutting off the catalytic converter. Is it OK to hack it off for the race?

Oh, here's a quick picture of the car. My friend is suppose to send me the rest of the pictures and videos sometime this millennium. It's originally from Oregon and in NV now.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b279/qwerty86/cellphone/lemons_chrysler.jpg

  • sergio
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Re: New to racing

No cats needed. Free HP!!!

  • Serj
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Re: New to racing

fifthavenue wrote:

We are aiming for "Going for Broken" but the deadline is quickly approaching. I have my sight on "Arse Sweat a Palooza" if we miss this deadline.

I never got an answer (or I missed it) about cutting off the catalytic converter. Is it OK to hack it off for the race?

Oh, here's a quick picture of the car. My friend is suppose to send me the rest of the pictures and videos sometime this millennium. It's originally from Oregon and in NV now.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b279/ … rysler.jpg

yeah. go hack'em off. replace with a piece of straight exhaust pipe (stock mufflers are actually a great idea) and you should get that 318 breathing very nicely!

make sure you have good hoses, and even judge murilee recommends getting a fresh water pump installed, especially if you're going to run Arse-sweat. Good luck!

  • From: Atlanta, GA
  • Registered: 2009-09-01
  • Posts: 561

Re: New to racing

Make sure your exhaust meets the rules when you're done.  From the header back is a safety expense to meet noise requirements and to make sure your exhaust isn't pointed at you're gas tank.

What's the next race ifb_mole is going to be at?  I will fly there just to watch him go through BS inspection with Johnny and Murilee.

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http://www.perpetualdownforce.com/

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  • ronman
  • ronman
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  • From: Orlando, FL
  • Registered: 2009-09-15
  • Posts: 1,842

Re: New to racing

Your car has an A-904 transmission.
A 727 won't fit in an M-body without some creative massaging of the tunnel for the shift linkage to fit.
Having owned several faster M's (14s in the quarter instead of 20s like they did stock) my biggest piece of advice would be to make sure your shocks are decent, make sure the rear springs haven't de-arced, and dump the Lean Burn system for a standard Mopar electronic ignition. Mopar Performance used to sell a conversion kit, which involves splicing about 5 wires, mounting 2  small boxes on the firewall, and removing a couple pounds of dead weight from the air cleaner.

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48 Reply by fifthavenue (edited by fifthavenue 2010-02-16 10:32 PM)

  • Registered: 2010-02-07
  • Posts: 9

Re: New to racing

I think this car does have electronic ignition. There's a computer attached to the air cleaner and there aren't any points in the distributor. We have the service manual for the car and it said there's an oxygen sensor there too (which I found odd since it's carburetted).

  • From: Land Of Subarus, Colorado
  • Registered: 2009-04-30
  • Posts: 9,416

Re: New to racing

Excellent car choice! Glue rhinestones all over it, put candelabras on the hood, and put on 100-pound gold lamé cloaks: Team Liberace!

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  • Registered: 2009-10-25
  • Posts: 1,993

Re: New to racing

NICE......your gonna have too much fun in that boat!!!

Richard Doty
1984 Porsche 928 "Estate"
Porsche- "there is A substitute" Racing
Dirt Poorsche Racing #2