Topic: Twin Engine Thread

Being a full time fabricator, race car builder im always thinking of how to build the next big thing ( for Lemons usually)


Judge Phil and Jonny have really been wanting a twin engined car to race in Lemons. Now how
to do it?

Please create your own wicked BUT PLAUSIBLE twin engine build with info. heres some of my ideas Pics if you can!:



#1



CAR:
1987-89 Acura Legend Coupe

http://www.free-desktop-wallpaper-download.com/data/media/142/1987_Acura_Legend_Coupe.jpg


ENGINES:
2 x Honda CA27
2.7L sohc v6 160hp,

http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff63/NuclearSymphony/FAQ%20pics/acura58.jpg

HOW:
buy 2 cars, use the factory engine up front, and another engine/ subframe/ suspension in the rear. preferably automatics ( cheaper, plentiful easy to match)

PROS:

320 hp, AWD,  12 cylinders, could set up 4wheel sterring too

CONS:

Heavy, complex build, cooilng and fuel storage shortage, rear engine access sucks, these cars have alot of emmission tubes so removing those and keeping it happy may be hard, heavy at 3400+ lbs





#2


CAR:

??? something  with a WIDE engine bay, ( full size caddy, something that had a big block and room to spare

http://www.libertysoftware.be/cml/mycars/1975/mycadillac/73EldoCoupe.jpg


ENGINES:

2x Toyota 7MGE( or simular straight 6)
200hp 3l in line dohc 6

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/36/Photo-0049.jpg

HOW:

engines sit side by side mabye V'd apart a bit for manifold clearances. use a heavy chain/ gear drive between the two on the front pullies linking them together, only Right side engine  mounted to transmisson ( drivetrain is then offset to the right away from driver) if your really ingenius, swap the left engines cams and valve timing to make it a reverse flow, now just one center intake and outer exhaust for less heap soak and what not so it becomes a v12 with 2 cranks.


PROS:

the noise of 2 awesome straight sixes, can call it the "twin six", only the front of vehicle is cramped with extra engines not both ends so there is plenty to add more to the fuel tank in the rear

CONS:

weak link of linking the 2 engines ( chain snaping, snout breaking off) Front weight bias is high. all power through just one trans. may have to build all new intake from stratch, them run on just one computer? or 12 individual single barrel carbs!




#3


CAR:

Porsche 928 ( or simular with long engine bay)

http://www.928s4vr.com/928s4005_files/928gtsid.jpg



ENGINES:

2x Mazda 13b, ghetto 4 rotor

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/158/338382649_f27f50e8b1.jpg

HOW:

Ghetto 4 rotor, consists of a redneck style machined coupler or maybe you if you feel lucky a simple but sturdy u joint/ guibo between the 2


PROS:

Again awesome sound, possibly have some measurable amount of tourqe now, high rpms to impress fellow racers, relativley simple mounting, great toyo kogyo trans behind them


CONS:

its a rotary and your junkyard grab already has 100k on it, what could happen? especially if you put 2 of them together, they may conspire against you. Fuel mileage will also be a horrid thing to deal with and if you use a 928, a new IRS pumpkin is needed to replace the transaxle you were to lazy to make an adaptor plate too

Have fun making you own ideas, lets here them!!

Re: Twin Engine Thread

How about doing a van like the snoopy van but with with dual engines hooked crank shaft to crank shaft.

E=MC Hammered
E30, 302I (ME car)
Pintoghini with turbo 2.3L
Old Spice Crown Victoria

3 (edited by squirrelly_z600 2010-02-14 10:17 PM)

Re: Twin Engine Thread

I'm going to go with twin bike engines coupled via spur gears a la British hillclimb circa 2001...something like the OMS Racing Cars entry with two Kawasaki ZX9R engines feeding a standard rear diff. 
http://sports.racer.net/images/chassis/oms/v8_hillclimb/twin_ZX9C.jpg
http://sports.racer.net/images/chassis/oms/v8_hillclimb/engine_top.jpg

Re: Twin Engine Thread

Evil Clint
OR the ultimate flat 8.....two VW engines grafted together!!!  It might fit in the 928....

But I like the dual rotary best.....BUT you gotta keep the transaxle.....

Richard Doty
1984 Porsche 928 "Estate"
Porsche- "there is A substitute" Racing
Dirt Poorsche Racing #2

Re: Twin Engine Thread

icemang17 wrote:

Evil Clint
OR the ultimate flat 8.....two VW engines grafted together!!!  It might fit in the 928....

But I like the dual rotary best.....BUT you gotta keep the transaxle.....

I hear something like the flat 8 may be under construction somewhere... or not... I know nothing... NOTHING!! big_smile

"Real ZomBees prefer Bacon"
IOE(x2) MGB/SAAB 96, Judge's Choice, Class C Win, & 2011 Hooniverse Car of the Year!
MRolla, Stick Figure/Animal House, Free Range MR2, SAAB Sonett, "The Death Flip"
2008 Exoskeleton Jag Fiasco, Concours d Lemons - Rue Britannia, worse British car.

Re: Twin Engine Thread

I have an 89 Buick Park Avenue and an 89 Olds 98.  If the Olds doesn't kill itself in our first outing we plan to accidentally make it twin engine... unless while getting ready for said race we get a few too many beers over the edge and decide it would be a good idea which is entirely possible.  I an only imaging how explody the Olds would be as an all-wheel drive 12 cylinder porker.

Team Merikuh
Omaha '10 wussed out, lost too many drivers sad
"Simplify, then add Awesome"

Re: Twin Engine Thread

http://image.carcraft.com/f/9579753/p135202_large+Showboat_Buick_Nailhead_Powered_Dragster+Front_View.jpg

Why just two engines? Engines are cheap!

Re: Twin Engine Thread

Is that TV Tommy Ivo?

Jim "Endo" Anderton
30 years of racing and still not Brambilla.....

Re: Twin Engine Thread

Just get two of the same FWD platform and graft it into a unibody car with a full cage. If you are indeed and master fabricator... then grafting in two Honda D16 or B18 engines shouldn't be too hard.

Sons of STIG
Judge Jonny, "So, what's the next formerly thought to be immune from winning that will steal the nickels?An MR2? A Fierro (ha ha ha)? A Datsun/Nissan Z? A Camaro?"

Re: Twin Engine Thread

Riktor wrote:

Just get two of the same FWD platform and graft it into a unibody car with a full cage. If you are indeed and master fabricator... then grafting in two Honda D16 or B18 engines shouldn't be too hard.

Indeed, follow this guy's lead and call it a day

http://www.durocco.com/

http://wartburg.misfittoysracing.com
OTTER: "I think that this situation absolutely requires a really futile and stupid gesture be done on somebody's part."
BLUTO: "We're just the guys to do it."

Re: Twin Engine Thread

JThw8 wrote:
Riktor wrote:

Just get two of the same FWD platform and graft it into a unibody car with a full cage. If you are indeed and master fabricator... then grafting in two Honda D16 or B18 engines shouldn't be too hard.

Indeed, follow this guy's lead and call it a day

http://www.durocco.com/

I will see your Durocco and raise you a Bimoto...

http://auto.vision.am/files/321269/23070703.jpg
FRONT ENGINE
http://images.europeancarweb.com/features/epcp_0803_11_z+mtm_audi_tt_bimoto_engine+top_view.jpg
REAR ENGINE
http://www.autoshow.permaisuri.com/Content/viewimage.asp?AutoID=20021207090322&Filename=7492.jpg

Sons of STIG
Judge Jonny, "So, what's the next formerly thought to be immune from winning that will steal the nickels?An MR2? A Fierro (ha ha ha)? A Datsun/Nissan Z? A Camaro?"

Re: Twin Engine Thread

we've thrown around this idea internally:

MR2 + FX16 = 1 car with dual engines (+bonus! 1 car with no engines)

match the rear of the MR2 to the front of the FX16.  2 x 4AGE engines (total ~220hp), AWD, no need to mess with driveshafts,etc.  figure out the throttle and the shifter cables, and rear engine cooling (MR2 rad mounts up front).

and how to keep the car from breaking in half on the track.

mike - Schumacher Taxi Service
12+-time loser
"Winner" - We Got Screwed, NJMP '11

13 (edited by Riktor 2010-02-15 07:39 AM)

Re: Twin Engine Thread

Personally, just about any japanese import with two engines screams cheat cheat cheat. Considering yuo take a generally reliable brand and now gave it a redundant system.

Now if you were to take this car:

http://static.howstuffworks.com/gif/chevrolet-caprice-5.jpg

And wedge in two Caddy 500's....

http://image.automotive.com/f/techarticles/engine/10267480+pheader/hrdp_0804_01_z+541_big_block_cadillac_v8+v8_engine_front_view.jpg

Now we are talking a car OOZING lemon zest.

Sons of STIG
Judge Jonny, "So, what's the next formerly thought to be immune from winning that will steal the nickels?An MR2? A Fierro (ha ha ha)? A Datsun/Nissan Z? A Camaro?"

Re: Twin Engine Thread

Buzz Killington wrote:

we've thrown around this idea internally:

MR2 + FX16 = 1 car with dual engines (+bonus! 1 car with no engines)

match the rear of the MR2 to the front of the FX16.  2 x 4AGE engines (total ~220hp), AWD, no need to mess with driveshafts,etc.  figure out the throttle and the shifter cables, and rear engine cooling (MR2 rad mounts up front).

and how to keep the car from breaking in half on the track.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2510/4051162717_7447420e13_o.jpg

Dave Heinig - Schumacher Taxi Service
coROLLa - 2 time loser, RWB MR2 - 5 time loser
The Craptation - IOE WINNER! Lemons South Spring 2010
Crown Vic - Please God Don't Ever Make Me Go Through That Again

Re: Twin Engine Thread

^^^ Best photochop ever... can barely tell.

Sons of STIG
Judge Jonny, "So, what's the next formerly thought to be immune from winning that will steal the nickels?An MR2? A Fierro (ha ha ha)? A Datsun/Nissan Z? A Camaro?"

Re: Twin Engine Thread

I've actually got a secret plan brewing on exactly these lines...

A freind of mine here started building a twin-engined Scirocco about 10 years ago.. don't know whether it still exists or not.  It was pretty close when I last saw it.

If it ain't broken, fix it 'til it is.

Re: Twin Engine Thread

Riktor wrote:

^^^ Best photochop ever... can barely tell.

It took me almost two minutes to put that together...

Dave Heinig - Schumacher Taxi Service
coROLLa - 2 time loser, RWB MR2 - 5 time loser
The Craptation - IOE WINNER! Lemons South Spring 2010
Crown Vic - Please God Don't Ever Make Me Go Through That Again

Re: Twin Engine Thread

We are gonna do a twin-engine Lemons car as well. It's just that we found something harder to do than twin Eldo drivetrains in the '61 Caddy, so naturally we're going with that.

I've already figure out how to do half of the twin-engined car. I built (unbuilt, really) this one years ago: http://www.break.com/index/2wheeler1.html

I also did this one, but I don't have video of it handy with the other half removed:
http://www.break.com/index/halfcar17.html

The Spirit was super easy. The Acura was a nightmare. The computer was behind the rear seat. It was better built, and harder to cut up. Hope that helps...

Captain: Speedycop & The Gang Of Outlaws -'94 Mark VIII (Least Horrible Yank Tank Stafford '09, NOLA '10) '61 Caddy (Org Choice-NL '09) '63 Tbird (EPIC Repair Failure-Gingerman '10, I Got Screwed-Summit Pt '10, I.O.E. WINNER Stafford '10!) '77 Lancia Scorpion (I.O.E. WINNER Joliet 2010!) '67 Galaxie 500 (Judges Choice-CMP '11)
Future Fleet: 1957 Ford Prefect 1942 Buick 1959 Bugeye Project GLCOAT

Re: Twin Engine Thread

Buzz Killington wrote:

and how to keep the car from breaking in half on the track.

Don't you trust my welding?

--Rob Leone Schumacher Taxi Service
We won the IOE at Southern Discomfort.
We got screwed at The Real Hoopties of New Jersey  and we took cars down with us.
We got the curse at Capitol Offense but they wouldn't let us destroy the car.

20

Re: Twin Engine Thread

Hmmm.  Does that mean your frankencar will have TWO exhausts to fall off during the race?  smile

Jer / Schumacher Taxi Service
2010 Spring CMP I.O.E. winner
2010 Sebring overall winner
1996 Miata, 1991 BMW E30, 1987 coROLLa (retired), 1984 Citation (retired), 1993 Miata (retired)

Re: Twin Engine Thread

i had a great twin-engined car concept. find an LH car with a running 3.5L. score a second front clip for a 3.5L LH car. remove gastank and rear suspension, cut your openings for the new engine, and drop the rear of the LH car onto the other drivetrain (it should look something like a VERY BAD rear-end accident with less sheetmetal issues) run the linkages together and remove all the steering crap from the rear suspension. fuel-cel where the passenger seat used to be, and viola! somewhere in the neighborhood of 450hp, AWD, and around 3,400lbs can be yours. if you can sync the throttle up correctly the thing would be as fast as a lambo in the straights. big_smile

Re: Twin Engine Thread

I got closer than you might think to a duel engined, awd, Gnome, but there where some issues.  The biggest was trying to get both transmissions to be in the same gear at the same time.  Imagine this:  You wrap those suckers to 12.5k rpm and it's time to shift, engine one hits 4th gear while engine two misses 4th and stays in 3rd.  Oh oh.  Once engine one shoots a rod through the case due to being twisted to 17.75k rpm by engine two and locks up the car could do an endo.  Even though that sounded pretty good I moved on.

I then started thinking about a way to mate the two motors and only use the transmission from just one.  After fragging all the remaining CBR900RR trans's west of the Rockies at last years Buttonwillow race I sobered up and did something totally stupid in another way.

Cars, cameras, and easy living...

Re: Twin Engine Thread

What about an electronically controlled automatic transmission and just use one computer for both trans?

Sons of STIG
Judge Jonny, "So, what's the next formerly thought to be immune from winning that will steal the nickels?An MR2? A Fierro (ha ha ha)? A Datsun/Nissan Z? A Camaro?"

Re: Twin Engine Thread

I briefly considered going twin engine on our metro build. Putting the SHO drivetrain in the back only disrupted fuel tank placement. The stock 1L 3cyl barely runs, so it would only be used as a backup drivetrain. I decided against it, trading the engine in front for the same wider track of the rear.

The SHO engine will probly conk out after 15laps and I'll be sorry.

The Charnal House Geo MetSHO: Turning less laps than a regular Metro, the hard way!

1969 Subaru 360

Re: Twin Engine Thread

^^^then you'll wish you had that backup drivetrain.  that should be standard for any SHO-engined entry.

mike - Schumacher Taxi Service
12+-time loser
"Winner" - We Got Screwed, NJMP '11