Topic: School me on weird brake wear.

For sunday at CT we had to swap to cheap brake pads because one of our ST-43s was finally almost to the backing plate. We put Duralast golds on the front of the car. One side had a brand new caliper+slides+pins+bracket, and the other was old original hardware. Both sides wore the pads unevenly as pictured. What causes this type of wear? Is it anything other than the pads are crap and not meant for this?

Our ST-43s were wearing unevenly, but not that way. We had taper from leading to trailing edge, or vice versa. Not sure if there's something we should look for with that too.

https://i.imgur.com/riuyAuh.jpg


I'd love to know what we should do as we're about to put brand new ST-43s on the car for the next race.

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Re: School me on weird brake wear.

The leading to trailing edge thing is normal, you can swap left/right pads to maximize your wear.

The picture posted is bizarre, you could almost justify if it was in the other direction due to heat build up.

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Re: School me on weird brake wear.

How snug was the pad to bracket interface? I've had pads come in the past with backing plates seemed to be slightly oversized and that caused them to bind up in the brackets and cause strange and premature wear. My solution has been to remove some backing plate material with a bench grinder and dremel to make sure that the pad is free floating in the bracket. If the mounting ear on the pad is sticking in the bracket that could help to explain what you're seeing.

Since you had new hardware on one side I's likely not a slide pin to bracket issue, but that's the other big one for uneven wear. The slide pin and mating hole need to be periodically cleaned out and re-greased with good high temp disc brake lube. When it gets old/dried out/overheated it tends to bind up.

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Re: School me on weird brake wear.

The pads fit decently, not too snug. They didn't free float with a ton of clearance, but I wouldn't say they were binding when I installed them. Certainly worth checking when we put good pads in there again though.

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Re: School me on weird brake wear.

The taper I ASSumed you were referring to was *in my head* back to front rather then top to bottom, I suspect something about your stuff has spread/stretched and is all junk
Time to disassemble and compare calipers/brackets to units that have never seen a racetrack.

If I a wrong, no clue...

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Re: School me on weird brake wear.

Team Infinniti wrote:

The taper I ASSumed you were referring to was *in my head* back to front rather then top to bottom, I suspect something about your stuff has spread/stretched and is all junk
Time to disassemble and compare calipers/brackets to units that have never seen a racetrack.

If I a wrong, no clue...


Like I said, one side was brand new (well, reman, no one sells brand new for anything reasonable), and one was old original parts. Both wore the same.

i'm leaning towards it just being shitty pads combined with the sleeves on these calipers being rubber and allowing flex.

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Re: School me on weird brake wear.

TheEngineer wrote:
Team Infinniti wrote:

The taper I ASSumed you were referring to was *in my head* back to front rather then top to bottom, I suspect something about your stuff has spread/stretched and is all junk
Time to disassemble and compare calipers/brackets to units that have never seen a racetrack.

If I a wrong, no clue...


Like I said, one side was brand new (well, reman, no one sells brand new for anything reasonable), and one was old original parts. Both wore the same.

i'm leaning towards it just being shitty pads combined with the sleeves on these calipers being rubber and allowing flex.

Are the inner and outer pads worn the same taper/direction ? If so, in my mind, that kind of cancels out the sliders.... Crappy pads or overheating will burn away quickly but evenly.

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Re: School me on weird brake wear.

It looks like flex in the bracket, sliders, and/or calipers.  It looks like top to bottom taper where the caliper pulled the top of the pad harder then the bottom or inner part. This caused the upper part of the pad to wear faster.
This was a problem that FOX Mustangs had when they had the 11 inch front brakes. A fix was to replace the rubber bushing on the caliper slides with SS sleeves. It wasn't a 100% fix but it was a whole lot better.

Re: School me on weird brake wear.

I agree with the flexing thinking. My best guess is the "fingers" opposite the piston(s) are flexing when squeezing. They also have the disadvantage of only reaching 60%? of the way across the backing plate to make things worse.
You could try to take measurements while someone stands on the brake pedal if you can find somewhere to consistently measure across the caliper opening.

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Re: School me on weird brake wear.

The sleeves are rubber, so I can understand flex there. Interesting that we didn't see this wear with the good pads, so I'll chalk that up to just a feature of the junk pads.

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Re: School me on weird brake wear.

What was your pedal feel like compared to with the ST43s?  More pressure required?

Do you get a lot of pad knock-pack?  Meaning a long brake pedal going into a corner following a high-G turn (or hitting a curb at track-out)?  If so, that's "spindle flex" and/or loose wheel bearings, and can do weird things to the pads.  And your underwear if it is bad enough.

What does the pad on the other side of the rotor look like?

As far as pad fit into the caliper guide slots goes, they should rattle.  The pad will get hotter (and hot faster) than the caliper, so thermal expansion will quickly eat clearance at that interface, and sticking pads are bad for a lot of reasons.

Re: School me on weird brake wear.

Pressure seemed to be the same as the ST-43s, or at least pedal resistance. It took more pressure overall because the pads are crap comparatively and you had to squeeze them harder to get good stopping force. But the pedal got firm in the same place, and resistive force was the same. There is a lot of vibration under braking, but that was starting with the ST-43s as well, I think the rotors just have buildup after 6 races. It was not a new thing with the crap pads.

Cant' say I noticed any knock back to speak of. The pedal engaged in the same place every time.

I don't know the inside pad. I noticed that while loading the car on the trailer, and now the car is 70 miles away in my dad's driveway. I'll ask if he can take a quick look sometime this week.

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Re: School me on weird brake wear.

Maybe the calipers spread over time.  It is a thing.

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Re: School me on weird brake wear.

Flex  We have this issue on our AER golf even with bronze caliper bushings.  we are putting an ap racing caliper on it now because we cannot solve it otherwise.

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Re: School me on weird brake wear.

Hopefully the other pad in the pair will help with diagnosis.

Could be the additional pressure required was flexing the calipers more.  Could be if the backing plates were tight they were binding when hot and latching "on", and if the guide tabs are nearer the outside edge of the pad you were getting more pressure on that edge.  I dunno.

This might be one of those "replace all the components and go back to decent pads" situations and hope the problem doesn't reappear.

Didn't you have another weird braking issue recently with this car?

Re: School me on weird brake wear.

hoverducky wrote:

Didn't you have another weird braking issue recently with this car?

I wouldn't call it weird. One corner had accelerated wear of the pads, but i'm like 99% sure that was related to a failing wheel bearing, which has since been replaced. I replaced the caliper and bracket on that corner too.

We're going to replace the other front caliper as it's time (failing dust shield), and go back to good pads now that we have the time to order them. If we see wear like this on the good pads we'll look into it more.

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Re: School me on weird brake wear.

TheEngineer wrote:

The sleeves are rubber, so I can understand flex there. Interesting that we didn't see this wear with the good pads, so I'll chalk that up to just a feature of the junk pads.

It looks like caliper flex to my eye. I think you are correct on the junk pad idea.
One of the reasons that uneven wear occurs front to back is the gas layer that builds
between the pad and the rotor front to back. That's why most pads now have a groove bisecting the pad top to bottom.
(It also allows visual wear indication.) Large pads may have two grooves trisecting the pad.
I'm thinking the the pad was floating on a layer of gases that the caliper couldn't completely overcome because of the flex issue.

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