Topic: Numbers Format

First off- I did read the rules and I know it clearly states: 

"3.J.3 Car Numbers. Numbers must be shown on both sides, and also the hood or roof.
Car numbers must be at least 12 inches tall and clearly readable. Numbers must be
white on black background or vice versa–if you choose another format, you’re just
increasing your chances of failing tech. Cars that show up with incorrect, improperly
formatted, or otherwise hard-to-read numbers will fail tech instantly."

I know it says "must" be white on black background or vice versa" but I have seen that not all Lemons cars that are out there racing are actually following this rule.

Our planned color scheme is two complimentary colors (dark purple & bright yellow) that would make the numbers extremely easy to see if painted with those colors.  I have been in charge of RallyCross timing and scoring for the past many many years, so I know the importance of easy to read car numbers (IE: NOT blue painters tape on a blue car).  I feel like putting our numbers in a black or white box will really mess with the Mojo-Jo-Jo of our paint design- so is there a way I could get pre-approval or a general consensus if what our numbers look like is ok?

Re: Numbers Format

A quick check is to walk about 100 feet away and see if they still look like numbers...

That guy

3 (edited by Guildenstern 2019-01-25 12:01 AM)

Re: Numbers Format

It just needs to be clearly contrasting and an easy font to read.

if you choose another format, you’re just
increasing your chances of failing tech

Which negates the

Numbers must be

Mistake By The Lake Racing (MBTL)
88 Thunderbird "THUNDERBIRDS ARE GO!"
A&D: 2014 Sebrings at Sebring (NSF), 2014 NJMP2 Jurassic Park (SpeedyCop), 2012 Summit Point J30 (PiNuts)
2018 Route Sucky-Suck Rally Miata.

4 (edited by VKZ24 2019-01-25 08:38 AM)

Re: Numbers Format

Take a look through the galleries from past races over the last 10 years and you will see quite a variety of sizes, colors, and fonts.  I'd guess that less than 20% of those have the boring white on black, vise versa, format. 

I personally think 12" tall numbers are way too small, hence why ours are 20" instead.  It all comes down to readability.  If your numbers are easy to read, you'll have no problems at tech.  Just keep in mind that easy to read is quite different at 5 feet away while sitting still, vs. from 100 feet at 90 MPH.

Captain
Team Super Westerfield Bros.
'93 Acura Integra - No VTEC Yo!

Re: Numbers Format

Our numbers are black against a bright yellow keeping with the theme of the car. They are larger than 12 inches and unfortunately have proven to be easily read by flaggers in heavy rain, snow and almost dark. It has been that way for over 9 years. At one point in the past Lemons asked any team that wanted to use something other than black on white to send a picture and request permission. I did and still have that approval email. But I still carry a can of white paint to every race.

Re: Numbers Format

I'm one of the mostly blind, colorblind, cranky old farts who has to read your number and therefore score you.   Go ahead, use small, weirdly shaped, low contrast numbers, we'll see how may laps you get...

-John

Gosh, my business card says 'Tech Tyrant'

Re: Numbers Format

Evil Genius wrote:

I'm one of the mostly blind, colorblind, cranky old farts who has to read your number and therefore score you.   Go ahead, use small, weirdly shaped, low contrast numbers, we'll see how may laps you get...

-John

is that what ransponders are for? That said not a chance I'd run anything smaller than 16" and on a contrsting background.

"get up and get your grandma outta here"

Re: Numbers Format

Also your "tow" point markers need to be contrasting. Red on Black is one combo that some people find hard to see.

#44 VW Jetta "Le Mondrian"
Arsesweat '17 finished 10th in (B), 3 finishes in 7 races
#96 Silver Subaru Legacy Automatic w Orange Top (formerly)

Re: Numbers Format

You could always post a picture of your numbers and we can make fun of them. 

I have incurred the Wrath of Roland a couple times.  Do not use 24 Hours of Lemons orange/yellow duct tape on a yellow car. 

http://www.murileemartin.com/UG/LAZ17/078-IMG_6971.html

Also, don't put numbers on your rear side windows.  For bonus Wrath points, have really messed up numbers and an incorrect transponder number in your registration.

Re: Numbers Format

Mr.Yuck wrote:
Evil Genius wrote:

I'm one of the mostly blind, colorblind, cranky old farts who has to read your number and therefore score you.   Go ahead, use small, weirdly shaped, low contrast numbers, we'll see how may laps you get...

-John

is that what ransponders are for? That said not a chance I'd run anything smaller than 16" and on a contrsting background.

It is, unless the transponders are being flaky, or the System just randomly does something stupid because single manufacturer monopoly design.

Mistake By The Lake Racing (MBTL)
88 Thunderbird "THUNDERBIRDS ARE GO!"
A&D: 2014 Sebrings at Sebring (NSF), 2014 NJMP2 Jurassic Park (SpeedyCop), 2012 Summit Point J30 (PiNuts)
2018 Route Sucky-Suck Rally Miata.

Re: Numbers Format

rb92673 wrote:

You could always post a picture of your numbers and we can make fun of them. 

I have incurred the Wrath of Roland a couple times.  Do not use 24 Hours of Lemons orange/yellow duct tape on a yellow car. 

http://www.murileemartin.com/UG/LAZ17/078-IMG_6971.html

Also, don't put numbers on your rear side windows.  For bonus Wrath points, have really messed up numbers and an incorrect transponder number in your registration.

To be fair to you, Numburz R Hard.

Mistake By The Lake Racing (MBTL)
88 Thunderbird "THUNDERBIRDS ARE GO!"
A&D: 2014 Sebrings at Sebring (NSF), 2014 NJMP2 Jurassic Park (SpeedyCop), 2012 Summit Point J30 (PiNuts)
2018 Route Sucky-Suck Rally Miata.

Re: Numbers Format

rb92673 wrote:

Do not use 24 Hours of Lemons orange/yellow duct tape on a yellow car.

Hey, I tried to buy the white tape but HQ had run out of it.

Is it really our team's fault that we weren't prepared and HQ didn't fix it for us?

Yes, yes it is.

1982 MG Metro 1300: IOE 2015 Pacific Northworst GP, Longest Distance 2010 Cd'L Box Wine Country Classic
1980 KV Mini 1: Worst of Show and Fright Pig Supremo 2009 Concours d'Lemons
1978 H Special: Second-Round Elimination 2010 Lemons Pinewood Derby at Sears Pointless
1967 SAAB 96: IOE 2012 Pacific Northworst GP

Re: Numbers Format

It's Bill's fault. He coulda just kept it white...

https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-ozap__kajSw/V0PXUUxwFXI/AAAAAAAAASI/_owbj-AQyuAKDNviseRmFz8ox2N5DaOZACK4B/s640/Screen%2BShot%2B2016-05-23%2Bat%2B9.23.23%2BPM.png

Re: Numbers Format

Obviously not everyone follows the rules/guidelines.  I have failed tech because our numbers were not black and white as the rule book states.  It all depends on who the inspector is and their mood at the moment.  We had used our old number paint scheme for 5ish races prior and passed, but on the 6th it failed.  So if you don't follow the rules make sure you have a backup plan.

Team Glue Sticks
00 Firebird, 02 X-Type, 93 NX2000, 00 Mazda 626 (Sold)
2016 NJMP Heroic Fix, 2017 NJMP Near Heroic Fix except we can't drive, 2017 Thompson I Got Screwed, 2019 Pitt Heroic Fix

Re: Numbers Format

LOL, actually it was my profile picture paint scheme that failed. Blue on white with big numbers and easy to read.  Those numbers are now black.

Team Glue Sticks
00 Firebird, 02 X-Type, 93 NX2000, 00 Mazda 626 (Sold)
2016 NJMP Heroic Fix, 2017 NJMP Near Heroic Fix except we can't drive, 2017 Thompson I Got Screwed, 2019 Pitt Heroic Fix

Re: Numbers Format

meyers0150 wrote:

LOL, actually it was my profile picture paint scheme that failed. Blue on white with big numbers and easy to read.  Those numbers are now black.

From here, looking at that tiny avatar pic, it appears your number is 39?  Is that correct?  If so, that sounds silly to me as that blue on white is as easy to read as black on white.  I'd say the numbers could be a good be a bit larger, but those colors should be fine IMO.

Captain
Team Super Westerfield Bros.
'93 Acura Integra - No VTEC Yo!

Re: Numbers Format

Nicely made, large, contrasting colored numbers are likely to pass. Meaning if you cut them from vinyl in a font that is clear and straight forward, and they are large, you're likely ok.

If you paint them by hand while drunk and looking at something else, expect them to not be ok.

If you're using a color scheme other than black and white for the numbers it's a good idea to run it past HQ just to check. Certain colors, while contrasting, may still be an issue. As with all things, it does not matter what the hive mind says, what matters is the ruling made by HQ.

20+ Time Loser FutilityMotorsport
Turbo Dodge Powered E36 Build
2008 Saab 9-5Aero Wagon
Retired - 1989 Dodge Daytona Shelby 2011-2015 "Lifetime Award for Lack of Achievement" IOE, 3X I got screwed, Organizer's Choice

Re: Numbers Format

I have the chumpcar number plate on my car and the only problem we've had is that the cumpcar logo looks like a "1" so we have to tape that over for Lemons.

I don't remove the vinyl plate because it costs something like $60 and they require it to run in that series..

http://i.imgur.com/R72gPMc.jpg

Takata R&D :: 93 Accord - team captain
GoPro 360 Heros :: BMW E28  - co-captain

Re: Numbers Format

rb92673 wrote:

You could always post a picture of your numbers and we can make fun of them. 

Also, don't put numbers on your rear side windows.


And here we go!  Luckily, rear side windows is a non-issue for us.

http://i66.tinypic.com/2kovx2.jpg

Re: Numbers Format

Mmmmmm Grape flavor.

Mistake By The Lake Racing (MBTL)
88 Thunderbird "THUNDERBIRDS ARE GO!"
A&D: 2014 Sebrings at Sebring (NSF), 2014 NJMP2 Jurassic Park (SpeedyCop), 2012 Summit Point J30 (PiNuts)
2018 Route Sucky-Suck Rally Miata.

Re: Numbers Format

Guildenstern wrote:

Mmmmmm Grape flavor.

There's a bit of lemon in there too....

Re: Numbers Format

Like a full sized box of Nerds.

Mistake By The Lake Racing (MBTL)
88 Thunderbird "THUNDERBIRDS ARE GO!"
A&D: 2014 Sebrings at Sebring (NSF), 2014 NJMP2 Jurassic Park (SpeedyCop), 2012 Summit Point J30 (PiNuts)
2018 Route Sucky-Suck Rally Miata.

Re: Numbers Format

Sylphy wrote:
rb92673 wrote:

You could always post a picture of your numbers and we can make fun of them. 

Also, don't put numbers on your rear side windows.


And here we go!  Luckily, rear side windows is a non-issue for us.

http://i66.tinypic.com/2kovx2.jpg


I think you will get more grief from the judges because it is a Miata than they will worry about your numbers.  I have raced cars with numbers way less visible than that.  Just my opinion.  Hopefully a Judge will come on and give you a blessing.

Re: Numbers Format

Compared to some of the stuff I've seen, Ray Charles could see the 3 on that car. Short of glow in the dark paint, how more legible could you be?

#888-Hong Kong Cavaliers Benz S500: formerly known as OMG Racing #140...
Judges Choice and Regional Award winner! Chuckwalla '12, Buttonwillow '13, BFE GP '15, Miller '14 & '15, Sonoma '13,'14,'15,'17, '18. Inde '16,'17,'18. Other foolishness: Finisher of the inaugural Lemons Rally, in the black Jag.... and IOE in the Super Snipe back in '12.

25 (edited by VKZ24 2019-03-18 10:57 AM)

Re: Numbers Format

3.J.3 Car Numbers. Numbers must be shown on both sides, and also the hood or roof.

Where's your roof number?  Oh, wait, where's your roof!?  Looks like you'll need a number on your hood as well.

Captain
Team Super Westerfield Bros.
'93 Acura Integra - No VTEC Yo!