The 24 Hours of Lemons Forums → Our Crappy Race → Opening a brake shop at Gingerman!
After burning through 4 calipers and 4 sets of pads, I'm thinking about putting a shingle out at Gingerman selling anything brake related. Wow..need to completely rethink our braking before the next Gingerman race!
How about driving slower? 
I remember posting about a month ago that brakes would be a huge issue. GMan is a brake eater for sure. It's pretty hard on tires as well.
Brakes were fine tires are real bad
Sounds like a pace adjustment is needed.
Sounds like a pace adjustment is needed.
Ahh...where's the fun in that!
it's great fun. Driving our car is like driving through a parking lot, in reverse at 30 mph.
Brakes were fine, tires were moderate if anything I expected it to be the other way, This being my first foray into 4 wheeled racing,
I will have to bring extra fire extinguishers though as We had to use our fueling extinguisher to put out the brake fire on the car next to us. Luckily We didn't have to fuel anytime soon and lucky they got us a new extinguisher before we had to again.
So funny story -
We ran EBC Red's at Nelson Ledges. We were in the pits for a solid 6-8 Hours and it was our first time ever driving and the track is relatively kind to brakes so we had moderate pad left and didn't change them...
About midway through Saturday - our driver came into the pits in re: funny pedal feel. When the car stopped in the paddock - the leaking brake fluid on the passenger side front ignited with a pretty wicked blue / green flame. So I started flipping out, "Fire! Fire!" - the Subie guys run over with a extinguisher and I put it out (Thanks Again). We had run out of pad, the metal backing was inside the piston, and the piston had pushed out past the seal and the fluid was pouring out - once the car finally stopped moving it was able to light.... crazy....
Amazingly, the seal was not damaged and the caliper with fresh pads (duralast FTMFW) and little else - we were able to continue racing
and tires - we DESTROYED a set and a half of tires out there - I blame over inflation and definitely inconsistent line taking by your friend and humble narrator.
Brakes were fine, tires were moderate if anything I expected it to be the other way, This being my first foray into 4 wheeled racing,
I will have to bring extra fire extinguishers though as We had to use our fueling extinguisher to put out the brake fire on the car next to us. Luckily We didn't have to fuel anytime soon and lucky they got us a new extinguisher before we had to again.
Well..rallying in the dirt IS far easier on brakes and tires....
We gave you a new fully charged extinguisher, right?!
After burning through 4 calipers and 4 sets of pads, I'm thinking about putting a shingle out at Gingerman selling anything brake related. Wow..need to completely rethink our braking before the next Gingerman race!
Wha?? You guys ran a neon, right? We use Hawk Blue front pads and (thicker) 2000-05 front rotors on our '95 neon, and it works well for 14+ hours of racing. The stock phenolic caliper pistons prevent fluid boiling. We just replace front pads/rotors and check/replace the caliper pistons before every race.
Wha?? You guys ran a neon, right? We use Hawk Blue front pads and (thicker) 2000-05 front rotors on our '95 neon, and it works well for 14+ hours of racing. The stock phenolic caliper pistons prevent fluid boiling. We just replace front pads/rotors and check/replace the caliper pistons before every race.
We had the Hawk HPS pads, which lasted about 8 hours, and an assortment of Autozone shelf products afterwards. We won't make that mistake again.
After burning through 4 calipers and 4 sets of pads, I'm thinking about putting a shingle out at Gingerman selling anything brake related. Wow..need to completely rethink our braking before the next Gingerman race!
What do you drive??? Whats is weight-HP?
I'd say its time for bigger brakes..... The 928 weighs 3150lbs with 195whp running 290mm vented discs all around (stock) with Raybestos ST43 pads, steel braided lines and Amsoil 580F fluid...NO issues at all and over 43 hours on track total, but the front pads are getting pretty thin...
widgetsltd wrote:Wha?? You guys ran a neon, right? We use Hawk Blue front pads and (thicker) 2000-05 front rotors on our '95 neon, and it works well for 14+ hours of racing. The stock phenolic caliper pistons prevent fluid boiling. We just replace front pads/rotors and check/replace the caliper pistons before every race.
We had the Hawk HPS pads, which lasted about 8 hours, and an assortment of Autozone shelf products afterwards. We won't make that mistake again.
Well, that pretty well validates my "Blue" theory el-Dudearino.. 
I hate the hawk blues. They have sucked on a few of my cars. Carbotech will make you any of their compounds custom. We have done 2 events on one set of their endurance pad, and can likely do 2 more.
Haha.... Smoking!
I think I remember walking past the Buick longboat with the exact same thing going on, smoking rotors, wiped pads, sizzling brake fluid piddling out of the caliper? And the stang bangers. and the S10... Definitely some heavy braking if you were going for FTOD.
Our front pads are shot, and the rear pads had to be changed before the start of sunday's festivities.
I think I remember walking past the Buick longboat with the exact same thing going on, smoking rotors, wiped pads, sizzling brake fluid piddling out of the caliper? And the stang bangers. and the S10... Definitely some heavy braking if you were going for FTOD.
Our front pads are shot, and the rear pads had to be changed before the start of sunday's festivities.
yeah, that was us. hell of a lot more smoke coming from both fronts that those silly neons 
we seized both calipers and had to take the angle grinder to the front-passenger side caliper just like we did @ CMP. gotta stop thinking a set of pads will run all day i guess, lol
Chris
#24 Track Pillagerz! -Captain
We ran Hawk HP+ on the Scirocket - ~1900 pounds, front vented rotors, rear drums of questionable function. Perfectly suited for GingerMan, way more brakes than necessary for Ledges.
We ran Hawk HP+ on the Scirocket - ~1900 pounds, front vented rotors, rear drums of questionable function. Perfectly suited for GingerMan, way more brakes than necessary for Ledges.
The Neon was only on HPS... just a little goof that cost us a bunch! I'm gonna vote for the Hawk endurance pads next time.
Alot of the comments prove a common mistake people make with their brake pad choice- you get what you pay for and it ends up costing you more in the end. Durlast, combo street/track pads, "high performance" street pads, etc. etc. are false economy.
People who are new to track driving are notorious overbrakers, so that right there demands an even more capable pad. Your best bet is a true racing pad. And true racing pads don't cost a mint. Hawk full on race pads are quite affordable, as are Porterfield pads. Just like Trevor said about Carbotech, Porterfield will make a pad for ANY vehicle you ask them to. All they need is the pad shape (send them your stock crap pads) and they'll make up a backing plate with race compound you need.
Because honestly, Gingerman isn't THAT hard on brakes guys... It puts them to the test for sure, but there's a lot of areas on the track that are either tap & go or long throttle areas to let the brakes cool. Phenolic (plastic) pistons are great, but they do nothing in terms of pad heat management. If you don't have pads that can handle the heat of overbraking (or lack of thermal mass in the rotors) then you'll just have brake fade/failure a different way than fluid boiling.
Why guess/hope and use a marginal pad? Get true race pads and have one less failure point on your ride.
I would put the neon on HP+ minimum for GingerMan, if not Blues. that way you can divebomb 11 and still live.
Ditto KTL. The Axxis Ultimate pads (which aren't even full-on race pads) on my E30 racer have made it through 2.5 races and still have over half of the material left.
On the other hand, I raced my friend's mostly identical E30 at the Infineon race and we went through a full set of "Duralast Gold" pads by the end of the first day, and burned through a second set in _5 hours_ on the second day. Unbelieveable.
Our mistake was not changing our pads after Nelson Ledges - I am fairly confident our pads (EBC - Redstuff), if new, would have made a full driving session if not both.
However, walking around the paddock on Sunday morning saw more people with the front brakes apart than not
The 24 Hours of Lemons Forums → Our Crappy Race → Opening a brake shop at Gingerman!
