Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

I think Lemons will have access to better an better dates now that popularity is growing.  However, they'll will have to cover a lot of ground to match a NASA event (just talking sheer participation) .  I drove with them for the first time a few months back at Sears and I can say they had approximately 700 billion people in the paddock between spec series, DE, time trials, etc...  Each of them forking over an entrance fee.

Paluck
Rooster Juice Racing
Bay Area, CA

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

Tracks typically charge a flat daily rental rate.

There are extra charges for corner workers, paramedics and tow trucks.

Entry fees go to the organization who rented the track.  Maybe some tracks get a percentage or there is profit sharing but I have never heard of it.

In Texas, the only differences I have seem in rental rates are weekdays versus weekends.  They don't care how hot or cold the drivers are as long as the checks clear.

I've been to NASA and SCCA events at MSRH.  I have never seen MSR more crowded or clustered than it is during Lemons.  With 120ish cars and say and average of 5 drivers per team, that's 600 drivers.  Then there are the crew/helpers and the spectators.  I have never seem a cluster like it at any other track event.

Granted, not all the tracks run 100+ car fields but I am sure it makes the margin even more attractive to the Staff.

All I can say about the 2011 schedule is I look forward to seeing what it has to offer.

Troy

#35 LRE
1973 Datsun 240Z

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

My area, yes repeat these!
1st choice: Sears Point(less) and workers that join in the fun, plus a track where driving skill means more than having a V-8 Volvo (which has both skill and a V-8)

2nd choice: Buttonwillow in the heat, the cold, the middle of nowhere... don't much need to say more - but if you can find the track and get there, and you needed spares, enjoy the beer ;-)

3rd, but actually close to 1st: Thunderhill, more than in the middle of nowhere, but with a Wally-world down the street for all the oil and cleaning supplies you (will definitely) need -- BUT, I want a chicane in one or both of the straights to even up the 120mph cars with the 80mph ones - it's like reading a phone book with someone pointing a gun at your head when you have a 'real' crap-can of a car at the end of those... and even *more* fun if you don't really need to lift for the following corners :+P

On the "I'd never" list: Willow Springs 2.5m original This course has only 2-1/2 turns if you have less than a gazzilion hp and the off-course excursion is into grapefruit sized kitty-litter.
~that said, The Streets of Willow is a cool, tight and a bit frustrating course...(in traffic) ...with off course obstacles of peach-sized kitty-litter.
~dunno 'bout the newest incarnation of Willow, as I have no desire to go back there until I can afford a gazzilion hp.

Also "Never" but for entirely different reasons: Laguna Seca - they have curfews. Major Curfews - I'm surprised they don't make cars running there have a radio-controlled cut-off so they can shut down at precisely 5pm. or is it 4:30?

the ones that got away:
-- for those in the other half of CA, If I could guarantee my tow-vehicle, income and time would allow, I'd love to do Coronado, Pomona, Country Club, and even Las Vegas...

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

VEGAS BABY.....well 45 minutes away from Vegas anyway....I'd vote for winter-spring...since summer-fall will be BRUTAL...

Richard Doty
1984 Porsche 928 "Estate"
Porsche- "there is A substitute" Racing
Dirt Poorsche Racing #2

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

Bumperoo!

It's mid September, and we are waiting for the 2011 schedule with "Bait on our breath" yikes

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

Maybe in October we'll know something.

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

icemang17 wrote:

VEGAS BABY.....well 45 minutes away from Vegas anyway....I'd vote for winter-spring...since summer-fall will be BRUTAL...

+1! geez, practically in our backyard... sorta....

Team photographer and "sure I'll drive" hanger-on: more races than I ever imagined... MRolla/FX32/Mormon Meteor IV
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Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

Waiting with baited breath...  We can't plan for next year if we don't know the schedule!

The Cannonball Bandits | Facebook Fan Page | Unununium Medal Winners 2010
3X Organizer's Choice Winner 2010 - Sears Pointless, Goin' For Broken, Arse Sweat-A-Palooza
1X Organizer's Choice Winner 2011 - Arse Sweat-A-Palooza

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

I would like to see a race at Beaverun.  NW of Pittsburgh, SE of Nelsons.  Nice track too.

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

craznoe wrote:

Waiting with baited breath...  We can't plan for next year if we don't know the schedule!

Likewise, I can't plan the stagger of my next 5 car builds. Ok, I've only got 4 lined up, but I'm looking to find a 5th!

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

Elkart Lake Please!
To be  on a track that has featured NASCAR (1957)  INDY CAR, Trans AM, CanAM, Plus now it's the Home of the  SCCA Run Offs.
  3 nice long straights with 14 corners that will cook anybodies brakes.. ,  The rush into Turn 5 and then charge up the hill to Blind turn 6
    The Hurry downs and carousel. leading to the fastest part of the track the run into Canada Corner..
The pits are fantastic!  Plenty of  hard spots  to park on or if you prefer (as I do)  the grass is soft and comfortable.  The amenities are great (Hot showers in the infield) 
AND!  the absolute best track food in the country.. 
  Family and friends can wander about 500 acres of woods and meadows..  With great viewing from a number of spots and locations..
     The absolute finest 4 miles in America.. (oh and the town itself is worth a trip alone)
Spend an evening at Siebekins and all three bars on site.. IF you're lucky one of the great chiefs of Chicago will come up and prepare meals for you..
Without exception the best race track in America.

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

+10 RA

Dudes Ex Machina: https://www.facebook.com/dudesexmachina

?Everyone who has ever built anywhere a 'new heaven' first found the power thereto in his own hell- Frederick Nietzsche

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

jnaught@comcast.net wrote:

I would like to see a race at Beaverun.  NW of Pittsburgh, SE of Nelsons.  Nice track too.

Decent track and pretty good facilities, but if it is the case that Jay had safety concerns at nelson (again, don't know if that is true) then there is no way he'd be ok with beaverun.  The kink on that track with 80+ cars....... :-)

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

Spank wrote:
craznoe wrote:

Waiting with baited breath...  We can't plan for next year if we don't know the schedule!

Likewise, I can't plan the stagger of my next 5 car builds. Ok, I've only got 4 lined up, but I'm looking to find a 5th!

You sir, are insane.  I'm very jealous!

The Cannonball Bandits | Facebook Fan Page | Unununium Medal Winners 2010
3X Organizer's Choice Winner 2010 - Sears Pointless, Goin' For Broken, Arse Sweat-A-Palooza
1X Organizer's Choice Winner 2011 - Arse Sweat-A-Palooza

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

I'm wating to plan my vacations around Lemons, so a 2011 schedule would be nice!

El Capitan de Substandard Racing -  Houston, Tx
2009 Yee Haw! It's Lemons Texas: 1973 Gremlin - Gremwow!
2010 Gator-O-Rama: 1973 Gremlin - Gremlin Express, Lassiez le Crapheaps Roulette - Gremlin - Most Heroic Fix
http://substandardracing.blogspot.com/

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

Looking forward to seeing the schedule.  We're waiting to build our first car and want to make sure we've got a race in the area.

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

Come on guys, WE NEED A SCHEDULE!!

Not much time to plan things if your race is in January (Like last year).

SCHEDULE!, SCHEDULE!, SCHEDULE!

tongue

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

I would imagine that we will see a schedule about Nov 1.

Bloomington, IN
We'll bring Beer!  Motorsports
Team Fiery Death! #0 2009 Lamest Day(65th), 2010 American Irony(24th), 2010 Detroit Bull(4th),2012 Capitol Offense (8th) 2012 American Irony (11 th), 2013 Capitol Offense (3rd) 2013 Chubba Chedder (4th, Judge Choice!) Now sadly part of a scrap pile. 
Toothless Racing Deadbeats #110 2011 Summit Point (61st) Currently being rebuilt into the new car!

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

craznoe wrote:
Spank wrote:
craznoe wrote:

Waiting with baited breath...  We can't plan for next year if we don't know the schedule!

Likewise, I can't plan the stagger of my next 5 car builds. Ok, I've only got 4 lined up, but I'm looking to find a 5th!

You sir, are insane.  I'm very jealous!

Build 5 complete cars? . You mean start from scratch and build 5 complete cars?
  Er,  why? 
  Why not build one good chassis and develop it  so you know for example that the alternator bracket will break every 3 races,, the radiator isn't good enough and the  brakes need a blast of cooling air to survive the race?   (or whatever details there are to finishing) IN addition once you build one good cage that should be all you need to build. Build the car rugged enough to take hits etc. and still run to the finish..
   OR is the challenge to you anticipating every potential weakness and deal with it prior to failure?  . 
  You have to admit it's an interesting subject!
Always run Saabs, BMW,  or Honda's etc.. and over time you collect enough parts so that little time is wasted scrounging.  Chassis wears out and simply move the roll cage to the new Chassis..
   
I've raced Jagaurs and the shop has been filling up with Jag spares etc.. for decades..
  It's the same way with most of the guys I know who race extensively..
  By the way, I'm not telling you that you're doing it wrong!   I'm asking.. Chances are you have a reason and I'd love to hear it..

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

You want the philosophical, introspective, "lie on the couch and tell me about your mother" answer or the overly simplified response?

1) I like the challenge and learning new things, and this car stuff is certainly a challenge since it's all new to me.
2) It's much more fun for me to start a new project than it is to perfect an old one.
3) I don't have the skills to perfect anything anyway.
3) It gets kinda, dare I say, boring seeing the same cars show up in the same configuration and I can imagine for the Lemons folks it's a bit of a treat for Lemons "Firsts" to show up (first mini, first sChitroen and the Apollo 18 car will be a Lemons first). The exception to "boring", of course, is the teams who excellently retheme for nearly every event.
4) I won't fool myself into thinking I'm the kind of person who can actually contend for a top-10 placing-- see point 3 above. But I can contend for IOE honors by finding some horrific cars, prepping them, and then doing what is necessary to make them circle the track for a weekend, which to me is the whole point behind the series.  I don't want to drive a fast car faster. I want to see if I can make a pile of shit drive.
5) I've always enjoyed being the guy who did things that other people thought made no sense.


I do have a car, the mini, that we've run in 4 Lemons and will continue to keep doing so as long as we keep having our entry accepted. It makes absolutely no sense to bring this spoon to a gun fight, but it's fun and has served Lemons well by introducing over a dozen new drivers to the series. Perfect it? Naaaw. Fix what needs fixing and get back out there, hence the current engine running pistons of 2 different sizes-- why mess with the ok ones when you only need to take care of the bad ones?

The sChitroen will see 1, possibly 2 more races with me but it won't be in my backyard after the New Year's race: I'll leave it for someone else to improve upon, or scrap it. Had I finished the Apollo 18 car in time for Arse Sweat, I would have had a new Lemons first car for Arse Freeze and then another new Lemons first for the season ender. But after failing at the Apollo 18 car timetable, I lost some build time moping around but am getting back on track. Seeing the 2011 schedule will help motivate me to get the other ones going again.

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

Lemons would be an even more awesome series if more people thought that way, Spank. cool

Official photographer/Team Police Brutality|Speedycop & the Gang
Lackey-mechanic-whatever/NSF Racing
Sycophant/Judge Phil, Jay Lamm, Kim Harmon
Galaxie Driver/not Parnelli Jones

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

I think you're spot on, Spank.  I think a new car does jazz up the judges, and the other racers.  We've been attempting to do the same thing on a smaller scale - I have vowed that the TetanusNeon will never race more than two events with the same theme.  Will I get lazy and use similar themes back to back?  Yes.  But there will be changes.  Otherwise I think things get a little boring.

I wish we could build out a new car at the frequency you do.  However, the cash flow just can't support that many new cars.  I am in awe of you sir.  Awe.

I'm the doctor who is a wife. Which makes the grease hard to explain to my patients... www.tetanusneon.com.

73 (edited by Spank 2010-10-09 09:05 PM)

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

Don't be in awe of me yet: I've only got 2.8 cars built in the last year thus far. The others are just idling in the backyard at the moment. You want to be in awe of someone, look East to Speedycop.

And cashflow? Uh, we're a 1 income family. Not much cashflow here and I have the credit card debt to prove it. However, in my insatiable appetite for Lemons candidates I've come across a couple of cars that I was going to Lemonize but ended up selling for a healthy profit which has helped. That and I get a good deal on DOM tubing from (warning, shameless plug approaching) www.summitsteel.net in Oceanside, CA. Plus I don't do anything but run the stock vehicle for the most part-- so what it came with is what I use (if it's still usable). I bought my own JD2 tubing bender and a notcher for $200, a welder for about the same, and started doing my own cages thanks to some 1-on-1 instruction and far too many late night readings of the FIA cage specs.

I've also had a lot of moral support and guidance from the folks on this board (and skilled material support from pendejo and magnus of the Jag team) and some good friends who live nearby.

So please, don't be in awe: just be excited to see what I bring next (one of which is no secret-- I'm going to have a twin-engine classic mini at some point in 2011-- it was supposed to be Buttonwillow of this year, but it's been bumped and once I see the schedule I'll have a better idea of a target date).

Now enough about me: Let's see the schedule!

74 (edited by Mulry 2010-10-10 06:47 AM)

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

Where on earth did you find a good bender and notcher for $200? I'd kill to find a deal like that.

Also, which FIA cage specs did you use? WRC? A linky would be greatly appreciated. smile

Pat Mulry, TARP Racing #67

Mandatory disclaimer: all opinions expressed are mine alone & not those of 24HOL, its mgmt, sponsors, etc.

Re: 2011 Lemons schedule?

Mulry wrote:

Where on earth did you find a good bender and notcher for $200? I'd kill to find a deal like that.

Also, which FIA cage specs did you use? WRC? A linky would be greatly appreciated. smile

craigslist. Same place I found the $1500-$7500 kwik way boring bar for $500. Love craigslist. The Bend Tech software cost some additional dough, though. If I weren't wanting to do it myself with the eye on doing multiple cages over the next few years, I'd just pay someone to do it (like evilgenius).

I've been using FIA article 253 appendix J to understand how it should be done according to them.

current link for .pdf download:
http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-public.ns … 080910.pdf


I've cross-referenced to Rally America and SCCA stuff to notice and understand the similarities/differences. I haven't done it to the letter (eg: there are no gussets yet on the mini), but paying attention to what they ask for and digging around and understanding why helps me when I come up against an unusual shape or demand. Rally stuff (ie hitting a tree) is different than colliding with another car in motion, or having a car in motion hit you, so there are some differences most particularly in door bars. The door bars in the mini are straight X whereas the sChitroen is "Nascar" style. Seeing how pendejo and evilgenius do their bowed out X bars, that's how I'll do the next one I think. The litmus test for me at each step (each bend, each notch, each weld,) is "Would I let my wife and/or child get in this car on track knowing this spot will be crucial to their survival." A bit melodramatic, but I'd rather the cage weigh 400lbs too much than things be left marginal.

again off topic, though. Schedule schedule schedule!