Re: Which one of these is not like the other?

the Judges have been BEGGING the forums to get/build/show up with a Chrysler TC; so, -IF- you could find one, chances are they'd want the whole ball of wax trackside versus the drivetrain.

Re: Which one of these is not like the other?

No, see, if you pull the drivetrain out of a TC By Maserati for use in a Lemons car, you then have the TC shell as a second Lemons car, into which you can drop an Iron Duke for a nightmare GM-Chrysler-Maserati combo.

Re: Which one of these is not like the other?

An E30 with the Maserati 4-popper would be a suitably terrible start for an Axis-theme.

Official photographer/Team Police Brutality|Speedycop & the Gang
Lackey-mechanic-whatever/NSF Racing
Sycophant/Judge Phil, Jay Lamm, Kim Harmon
Galaxie Driver/not Parnelli Jones

54 (edited by typHOON 2010-12-19 05:56 AM)

Re: Which one of these is not like the other?

Judge Phil wrote:

No, see, if you pull the drivetrain out of a TC By Maserati for use in a Lemons car, you then have the TC shell as a second Lemons car, into which you can drop an Iron Duke for a nightmare GM-Chrysler-Maserati combo.

Swapping parts among two entries also means you have double the budget to play with.  Find that Iron Duke in a free car, and I'm sure that you'd be able to sell the TC's roof, interior, and other parts to get one of these under budget.

http://marshall.craigslist.org/cto/2102681437.html
"I am willing to trade it for a full size truck, van or a decent car that would put my insurance rates in a different tier group."

http://cincinnati.craigslist.org/cto/2091607654.html

http://collegestation.craigslist.org/pt … 37970.html

http://losangeles.craigslist.org/sfv/ct … 18379.html

http://orlando.craigslist.org/cto/2106466257.html

http://milwaukee.craigslist.org/ctd/2106657651.html

Re: Which one of these is not like the other?

The audi V8 is an awesome idea if it would fit.  Email me if you want dimensions.  It bolts to most of audis longitudinal transmissions.  The v8's had an "016" transmission which is similar to a 4000Q (slightly different "016".)  The quattro boxes with locking center diff can be locked and used as fwd only or you can use a fwd (weak) a4 or 80/90 fwd trans.  The thing that makes this swap really tough for Lemons is the unobtanium 5 speed V8 flywheel.  There were VERY few standard '90-92 audi v8's brought here.  A 5cyl, v6, or 1.8t would bolt up too, just stay far away from the audi 12v V6.

  You could probably bolt the whole v8 or whatever subframe and suspension in the rear but it would be ridiculously wide, which might be perfect.

-Killer B's (as in rally) '84 4000Q 4.2V8. Audis never win?

Re: Which one of these is not like the other?

X-args wrote:

You need the hard to find muncie/getrag 282 or NV-550 (same trans w/different throwout actuation). That will bolt up behind a 3800, and there are still a few cheap NEW ebay ones out there, if you can find a V6 cavalier case half to swap...

The Isuzu 5 speed wasn't strong enough.

We had 200-ish HP and the trans was fine, it just took almost a year of looking to find a Lemons-budget transmission...

The 282 wasn't the hard one to find, the hard one to find is the 284 that was behind the 3.4 DOHC.

The 282 5-spd came attached to all the FWD 2.8/3.1 engines starting from around 1986.  Look for Cavaliers, etc.  Before the 5-spd was a 4-spd that was reputed to be more durable, and could be had with several different final drives and internal ratios.

It'll bolt up to a FWD 3800 block, but not the RWD 3.8.  Fiero people do it all the time.  For what it's worth, that transmission will also bolt to a Northstar...

Doug Chase

Doug Chase
Good cages for bad drivers
Duvall, WA

57 (edited by Crab Spirits 2010-12-22 07:00 AM)

Re: Which one of these is not like the other?

Yes!
I tried like hell to find that shot of an R5 engine bay when we were doing our swap. It actually looks kind of similar.
http://home.comcast.net/~movistar323/gtowers7.jpg

For a powertrain, you should consider using an 84-92 5spd Maxima donor with the SOHC VG. As well as a Z31 turbo donor. You should be able to find both in your area for near nothing. Use the Z's front suspension, steering and crossmember in the LeCar. This will give you great brakes and suspension all around. All the turbo stuff:ECU, harness, injectors, turbo, LH exh manifold will bolt onto the maxima engine. With boost at about 10psi, you can make 220hp reliably.
Whatever goes into this car needs to be turbo. Saab, 4G63, whatever.

Protip:
-WELD your engine cradle into the chassis. We wasted a ton of time and some of our budget making it "easy" to drop out in the event of a major repair. Let's just say if something like that should happen to us, we will be dismantling everything and taking it out piece by piece.
-Make sure your cradle/suspension sits as it did in whatever car you take it out of.
-The biggest hurdle will be your control linkages. Don't leave them till the last minute. Fiero throttle cable, and Daihatsui Hijet clutch cable is what I used. Hopefully, you use a hydraulic clutch release setup, or modify it to use hydraulics. The shifter sucks as it comes in from the wrong side at the trans as well as the shifter itself. I would suggest looking at cables from a boat or COE semi or something.
-Plan on using an expensive fuel cell.
-Go overkill on locking down the rear steering rack. Our car got hit hard enough to tweek a 3/4" thick rod and shoot residual fluid out of the rack. Had I not made this part strong, things would have gone really bad.
-Our strut towers are made from a basketball post. Finding something overkill like that and welding it into the car makes that task super easy.

Best of luck!

The Charnal House Geo MetSHO: Turning less laps than a regular Metro, the hard way!

1969 Subaru 360

Re: Which one of these is not like the other?

Right, forgot about the FWD/RWD 3800/3.8 block differences. but they used the FWD block in the '95+ Camaro/Firebird.

I'll agree the 284 is the unicorn transmission, supposedly less than 5000 made.
Finding a 282 that isn't destroyed isn't that easy, the last ones were made in 1995 or so, and not a lot of little old ladies bought manual Z24 Cavaliers, unless they were from Pasadena...

The 282/NV550 was only rated for 200-ish hp, so you could bolt a Northstar to it I don't think it would live very long... What you really want is an F40 6-speed!

2x Volvo PV544 (RIP '63) B20 power!
2007/2012/2013 Driver's Championship (what was I thinking!?) 146 races and counting.
5/24/24

Re: Which one of these is not like the other?

Lots of good stuff here.

Crab, what did you use for a firewall?  Did you just put a cover over the top of the engine?  Seems like over-heating would then be a problem.

What I'd like to do is put the firewall in front of the engine with a window so you can see out the back.  Is this allowed?

-Victor

60 (edited by Crab Spirits 2010-12-22 10:00 AM)

Re: Which one of these is not like the other?

Nope.
I tried the same thing. Won't pass tech.

We built a simple framework out of 1" square tubing and covered it with an aluminum billboard secured on the top with hand screws.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/thecrapper … 296852904/

Heat was not a problem. We heard about the problems the Dauphine had, and mounted the electronics outside of the engine compartment. We have a temp sensor inside there and saw 180*F though.

The Charnal House Geo MetSHO: Turning less laps than a regular Metro, the hard way!

1969 Subaru 360