Topic: Beam Axle?

The maddening efforts to try to lengthen swingarms so we could increase our wheel size 50% (from 10" diameter to 15" diameter-- and subsequently increase the wheel weight by another 120%) only to break our 43 year old rear subframe and then a pivot shaft mid race is more or less proof enough that if we want real, Lemons legal tires we need a rear suspension different than what the factory supplied it with.

I've read that a beam axle could be a good option. But how, or more importantly what vehicle can I rob a decent beam axle from? The moke's typical setup is an IRS and has about 2"-4" max of suspension travel so I'm not sure what a solid beam axle will do to it's handling.

Is this something I can just make myself with little/no experience in this sort of thing? Ok, I already know the answer to that: It's Lemons: try it once and then I'll be experienced.

Re: Beam Axle?

look underneath a K-car. you can either rob/modify something from one of those, or at least get some inspiration. a beam axle will lead to a loss of handling precision, and give more likelihood for the rear end to "hop" on mid-corner bumps. there are many examples of recent, modern cars that sport beam axles and do very well when they're tuned correctly. Another possibility you may want to consider (just for fun or for loss of marbles) is that many 1990s-era GM vehicles had this hybrid-ish, seemingly corvette-inspired IRS that uses a transverse leaf spring assembly. Most likely those will be waaaaaaay too wide for a moke. that could be pretty entertaining with fat tires, really big fenders, and wheels with painfully high FWD-stlye offset, like +48mm

Re: Beam Axle?

How about a VW Rabbit (Mk1/A1) twist beam axle, as seen in this expired Ebay auction?  There should be spindles at the two ends, but you could easily buy a WHOLE RABBIT for what they were asking for just the beam.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Solid-Re … ccessories

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4 (edited by Spank 2010-12-13 11:04 PM)

Re: Beam Axle?

Maybe when I said IRS I should have said the moke has a trailing arm rear suspension. I can more or less do away with the subframe if I go to coilovers, but I'm not so keen on keeping the stock trailing arms since that pivot shaft broke and sent one of the drivers dancing off into the field with sudden and random rear wheel steering.

If the beam axle is a bad idea, I'm wondering if I can some up with some tubular steel triangular rear arms that I can just put a cheap coilover on.

edit: Like this http://www.force-racing.co.uk/uploads/i/wh180/rear-swing-arm-2.jpg

Re: Beam Axle?

A Toyota Tercel is a little more modern than an early Rabbit, hence easier to find in salvage, and should be pretty close to narrow enough.  Should be a pretty straightforward installation, you'll just need a pair of pivot points at the front, upper spring perches in the floor behind that and upper shock mounts somewhere above the hubs.

Lemons South 2008 - Fail, Lemons South Spring 2009 - Fail, Lemons Detroit(ish) 2008 - Fail, Lemons South Fall 2009 - Fail, Lamest Day 2009 - Fail, Miami 2010 (Chump) - 2nd!, Sebring 2010 (Chump) - Fail, Cuba 2010 - Crew Chief, Roebling 2011 (Chump) - 8th!, Sebring 2011(Chump) - 19th!

6 (edited by FJ40Jim 2010-12-14 06:32 AM)

Re: Beam Axle?

I second the K-car (any FWD mopar, 1980-late '90's) style rear beam.  They are easily cut in the middle, then welded back together w/ a scab plate or tube to get the narrower width.  Available w/ various coil or leaf springs and shock locations.  The coil spring type locate w/ a pair of trailing links and a panhard rod.

A1/A2/A3 golf/jetta are also easy to narrow.  An advantage to the VW is the coilover rear shock only requires a single upper strut mount and a single body pivot on each side.

Jim C.
If God meant for us to race, we'd all have baggy Nomex skin.
08TMS.09NL.10GM, SP, NL.11SP, NL.12SP, VIR, NL.13GM, NJ.14NJ, VIR, WGI.15AB.16GM.17NCM.18GM.19...

Re: Beam Axle?

Spank wrote:

Maybe when I said IRS I should have said the moke has a trailing arm rear suspension. I can more or less do away with the subframe if I go to coilovers, but I'm not so keen on keeping the stock trailing arms since that pivot shaft broke and sent one of the drivers dancing off into the field with sudden and random rear wheel steering.

If the beam axle is a bad idea, I'm wondering if I can some up with some tubular steel triangular rear arms that I can just put a cheap coilover on.

edit: Like this http://www.force-racing.co.uk/uploads/i … -arm-2.jpg

The Renault Le Car has trailing arms which should be plenty stout enough for a Moke.  I've got some that I just took off lying around if you're ever near Colorado.

They're set up for using a torsion spring - which can be pretty handy - but you can use a normal spring with them if you wanted.

-Victor

Re: Beam Axle?

I'm guessing the mini moke has a flat rear deck underside?? why don't you graft up a 240sx rear end, or similar (Datsun 510, 240z)? Those are full IRS, have the cross-member already built, spring mounts built in. shocks, etc..... Once you get the cross member and diff bolted up then you can just locate the rest of the interface points accordingly, and cut the drive shaft.

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Re: Beam Axle?

It is, or was, a flat deck back there, but there's absolutely no strength to it. Plus to get a fuel cell in there I lowered it down through the rear load/seat area. Here's what's  left:

http://hubgarage.s3.amazonaws.com/photos/3604531/DSC03751_detail.JPG

basically, not much.

I appreciate the ideas and suggestions!

Re: Beam Axle?

Spank wrote:

Maybe when I said IRS I should have said the moke has a trailing arm rear suspension. I can more or less do away with the subframe if I go to coilovers, but I'm not so keen on keeping the stock trailing arms since that pivot shaft broke and sent one of the drivers dancing off into the field with sudden and random rear wheel steering.

If the beam axle is a bad idea, I'm wondering if I can some up with some tubular steel triangular rear arms that I can just put a cheap coilover on.

edit: Like this http://www.force-racing.co.uk/uploads/i … -arm-2.jpg

http://www.superturbodiesel.com/images/benz/w123%20maintentance/w123%20rear%20suspension/w123%20rear%20suspension.jpg

Possible overkill, but how about all that plus the addition of rear disk brakes? All for the price of "Scrap Value" depending on where you do your shopping?

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/19/161402768_c5c5255105.jpg

-=Tom

-=HFC Tom

11 (edited by crazymike 2010-12-14 09:29 AM)

Re: Beam Axle?

Hey Spank -
Rabbit, complete as per above
Good:
- you can cut/splice it in the middle with plenty of weld-strength available to narrow it.
- it is exceptionally easy to mount, needs only two points on the forward, just like the mini already has
- It uses spindles with a pretty common bolt circle (for a four-bolt)
- It will mount forward of your existing tank location and swing back just like the original mini stuff
Bad:
- It uses "coil over" semi mac-struts as shocks. You will need to adapt 'cause I just can't see getting the mini cones to work with it.
-- maybe use motorcycle shocks on the back of the Lunar Rover?

Re: Beam Axle?

I don't think I would cut the rabbit beam, it is under torsional load with a lot of leverage to break a weld.  It is also designed to flex, which is also not friendly to welds.

Re: Beam Axle?

...and when stock, unmodified twist beam axles crack, it's usually in the heat-affected area next to a weld.

Team Co-Craptain, Los Cerdos Voladores
Plymouth Neon
Yeah, we're horrible...but we're LEAST Horrible

Re: Beam Axle?

How about the axle off a Harbor Freight trailer? It's around 55" wide and has longitudinal leaf springs.

Re: Beam Axle?

The car is already slow and has funny handling...ditch the axle entirely and make it into a "Mini Cooper--Three Wheeler" for maximum Lemons tongue
http://www.classicandperformancecar.com/front_website/octane_interact/modelpicture.php?id=4354

Re: Beam Axle?

SuperDave wrote:

I don't think I would cut the rabbit beam, it is under torsional load with a lot of leverage to break a weld.  It is also designed to flex, which is also not friendly to welds.

not so much on a 1100# car that doesn't lean - it'll lift the inside wheel first.

that said - overlap and bolt-through would be easier and more effective - and still work.

Re: Beam Axle?

crazymike wrote:
SuperDave wrote:

I don't think I would cut the rabbit beam, it is under torsional load with a lot of leverage to break a weld.  It is also designed to flex, which is also not friendly to welds.

not so much on a 1100# car that doesn't lean - it'll lift the inside wheel first.

that said - overlap and bolt-through would be easier and more effective - and still work.

X2.  It's an 1100# moke w/ a CoG about 12" off the ground.  Roll forces are tiny.

Jim C.
If God meant for us to race, we'd all have baggy Nomex skin.
08TMS.09NL.10GM, SP, NL.11SP, NL.12SP, VIR, NL.13GM, NJ.14NJ, VIR, WGI.15AB.16GM.17NCM.18GM.19...

Re: Beam Axle?

Is this rwd or fwd? i dont know what car you have..

  If its fwd, a 90's nissan rear beam axle, se-r and maybe the normal sentra and 200sx too has a watts link rear axle that should be pretty easy to shorten if needed.  http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v311/ … ldrear.jpg

-Killer B's (as in rally) '84 4000Q 4.2V8. Audis never win?

Re: Beam Axle?

Don't shorten it.  Just stick on some big tubs for fenders.

It'd be cool to see a car that's wider than it is long.

-Victor

Re: Beam Axle?

First Gen CRX

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