Re: Couple of Roll Cage questions...Safe or Legal?

mikespeed95 wrote:
Doug I wrote:
mikespeed95 wrote:

Where are you people getting these sketch cages?

They....cut.....the....roof.....off.....!!!WTF!!!

There needs to be a "Go here for cages" thread.

maybe they just haven't welded it back on yet ....... get the cage in, get the 360 welds done and stick the roof back on.

No no no...you're not getting my point, let me add some bold.

What IDIOT cuts the roof off in the 1st place to install a cage...

W T F .

Actually we did.  In our MR2, we basically couldn't fit in the car and have a cage in it at the same time (SCCA 2" rule before there was a Lemons 2" rule) so we took the roof off to install a cage. 

I also cut flaps in the roof of Lemons cars to get the tops of the cage welds. Yes, I know how to drop the cage and I think doing this is still easier - 30 seconds with a plasma and I'm in.  It's not like we are making a Porsche Cup Car.

--Rob Leone Schumacher Taxi Service
We won the IOE at Southern Discomfort.
We got screwed at The Real Hoopties of New Jersey  and we took cars down with us.
We got the curse at Capitol Offense but they wouldn't let us destroy the car.

Re: Couple of Roll Cage questions...Safe or Legal?

Clint did the 4" hole thing in the roof for the bug upper welds - quick and easy compared to dropping the cage.
The refit of the holes, while not necc. was quick and painless - and not really needed as it is a Lemons car.

~didn't notice the mile of room between the front legs and the a-panel on that pic. Damn that's a long way away from being "follow the a-pillar".
w/o a roof that thing will fold right at your ankles. Trust me, that is a path to crutches and wheelchair for six months (seen results of that particular hit) in a front-end impact.

Re: Couple of Roll Cage questions...Safe or Legal?

Some of the shops that do really high end race cars will cut the roof skin off.  Some guys even take the windows out, psht, crazy.

-Killer B's (as in rally) '84 4000Q 4.2V8. Audis never win?

29 (edited by harddriveracing.com 2011-03-21 06:37 AM)

Re: Couple of Roll Cage questions...Safe or Legal?

Well three things.  First of all the roof was on top of the seats when we got the car, as well as used tampons, a foot of mud, and what I will only explain as debris for the sake of your Monday morning breakfast.  Second its infinitely easier to build a cage with the roof off. Since this is Lemons, you are out very little if you value your time when slice that rusty pop can lid off.  Third our theme demanded a slice to the lid...you'll see. 

On to the spreader plates.  Since the beam is super thick I think we'll be fine.  If there is time maybe we'll see if the cage builder can come in and work some magic.  If not and we need em you'll see sparks flying before we go through tech. 

Now onto something else.  The doors on the thing were cut down because we have a big guy and some old guys on the team (think 5XL for the big guy).  So the door goes down to the door bar.  Do you think we should add another bar or add a net or both?  Or just leave it be.  To me thats a big opening.  What to you think?

http://www.noheat.com/images/photodoor_.jpg

Re: Couple of Roll Cage questions...Safe or Legal?

You will 100%  fail tech without spreaders.

There is no wiggle room on this.



KT

TH 2009- 40th ~ SP 2010- 13th Class Bad win!! TH 2010- 17th ~TH 2010- 16th  SP 2011- 20th ~ RF 2011- 13th Least Horrible Yank Tank ~ TH 2011- 79th
SP 2011- 105th ~ SP 2012- 119th ~ SP 2013- 139th ~ BW 2013- 17th
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Re: Couple of Roll Cage questions...Safe or Legal?

Evil Genius wrote:

Must have spreader plates.

^^
This

While we understand your explanation of why spreader plates may be redundant-- make them Redundant! Why friggin' risk it. THE MAN already said you MUST have spreader plates. So put in spreader plates.

Re: Couple of Roll Cage questions...Safe or Legal?

Ok I get it.  We'll get it back to the cage guy. 

What about the window?

Re: Couple of Roll Cage questions...Safe or Legal?

I can't speak for rules and requirements, but from a foreign object entry perspective, I'd say to put a net in. You can always leave it out if it creates more of a problem and tech says you don't "need" it at the track.

Re: Couple of Roll Cage questions...Safe or Legal?

I think you'll probably get 2000 BS laps and fail tech.

If you need more interior room buy a 1978 El Camino.





JRBE, a LOT of REAL RACE CARS also skin the roof, and replace the windows with lexan.

Tools for properly removing a roof:
spot weld cutter
drill
knife
heat gun


Tools for being an idiot who doesn't know what you're doing, or saving a life:
SAWZALL


Looks like if y'all are cool with failing tech and BS laps, you should at least consider driver confort and get a telescoping steering column.

Mike Peters
Former rotary brat pioneer.
3.17.08 Jalopnik Hoon of the day.  #hasbeen
1984 Dodge Rampage, A few SHO engines, a Mustang 8.8, and a lot of hot glue going on now.

Re: Couple of Roll Cage questions...Safe or Legal?

Also proper tools for removal of roof...teenage girl driving on roof through a field. 

OK so the car is going back to cage guy tonight for spreader plates, and a net will be ordered.  Thanks for your help!

Re: Couple of Roll Cage questions...Safe or Legal?

It's common to cut the roof off when building a cage.  A ProRally legal cage has a LOT of tubing and welds, and it's easier to do the welds after the roof is cut off at the base of the pillars.  All the glass is coming out anyway, so a few minutes with the sawzall gets the roof out of the way.

Also, the roof cut technique comes in handy when the rally car gets balled up and there's another rally in 3 weeks.  Cut hat off old car, pick cage up out of car.  Cut hat off new car, drop cage in.  Reweld hat, apply paint & lexan.  Rally on! smile

Jim C.
If God meant for us to race, we'd all have baggy Nomex skin.
08TMS.09NL.10GM, SP, NL.11SP, NL.12SP, VIR, NL.13GM, NJ.14NJ, VIR, WGI.15AB.16GM.17NCM.18GM.19...

Re: Couple of Roll Cage questions...Safe or Legal?

This:

harddriveracing.com wrote:

Also proper tools for removal of roof...teenage girl driving on roof through a field.

still does not explain this:

harddriveracing.com wrote:

Well three things.  First of all the roof was on top of the seats when we got the car, as well as used tampons...

I'm not really sure that I want the full explanation for that though. But I did have a basketball coach in high school who kept new & unused tampons in the first aid kit because (he said) "nothing soaks up blood better in a pinch." He was a weird dude.

Pat Mulry, TARP Racing #67

Mandatory disclaimer: all opinions expressed are mine alone & not those of 24HOL, its mgmt, sponsors, etc.

Re: Couple of Roll Cage questions...Safe or Legal?

Let's hope she maintained her car better than her hygiene.  There must have been a couple bags of garbage in the back seat when she rolled it MANY times.  I'm sure letting it sit for 2 years probably didn't help matters any.

Grossness aside, how do you roll your car, punch in the nose and seriously kill every panel on the car without popping the air bags?

We ended up selling those bags, but I wouldn't want them in my car.

Re: Couple of Roll Cage questions...Safe or Legal?

mikespeed95 wrote:

Tools for properly removing a roof when you are SRS BZNS:
spot weld cutter
drill
knife
heat gun


Tools for when you don't want to spend 8 years removing the roof:
SAWZALL

fixed for you.  wink

mike - Schumacher Taxi Service
12+-time loser
"Winner" - We Got Screwed, NJMP '11

Re: Couple of Roll Cage questions...Safe or Legal?

Tools for not spending 8 hours for removing the roof, because you use common sense and just take 5 minutes to drop the cage:

Plasma cutter.

Saw other thread, pretty sure the cage will fail tech, but the horrid camaro splicing is awesome.

Mike Peters
Former rotary brat pioneer.
3.17.08 Jalopnik Hoon of the day.  #hasbeen
1984 Dodge Rampage, A few SHO engines, a Mustang 8.8, and a lot of hot glue going on now.

Re: Couple of Roll Cage questions...Safe or Legal?

harddriveracing.com wrote:

Grossness aside, how do you roll your car, punch in the nose and seriously kill every panel on the car without popping the air bags?

We ended up selling those bags, but I wouldn't want them in my car.

Oddly - airbags are programmed only to go off in frontal collision. Well, not oddly - this is by design. IF she went airborne w/o an impact, then landed on the roof, and then knocked the piss out of the electrical system, then hit the nose, the airbags would not go off. Or some such scenario that includes the nose-job either after momentum is lost or the electrics have died (there also may be a sensor that disables after primary non-frontal impact, but I'm not at all sure about that)

Good Sale! Airbags can offset the price of a lemon to zero if you have enough of them.

Re: Couple of Roll Cage questions...Safe or Legal?

Dude, a sawzall is exactly the right tool to cut the roof off.  This isn't Monterey for chrissakes.

Quad4 CRX - Wartburg 311 - Civic Wagovan - Parnelli Jones Galaxie - LS400 - Lancia MR2 - Boat - Sentra - 56 Ford Victoria
Known Associate of 3pedal Mafia, Speedycop, and the Russians.  Maybe even NSF.

43 (edited by Spinnetti 2011-03-22 02:37 PM)

Re: Couple of Roll Cage questions...Safe or Legal?

Wow! What a tough crowd! I thought the cage was better than 90% of what I've seen at Lemons including from some folks who are getting paid! (except the huge distance front the front down tube to the cowl... Fold up city!

"Don't mess with Lexas!" LS400. We survived another one! See website link for build details.
Maker of the "unofficial Lemons fish!" - If you ask nice, I'll likely give you one at the track.

Re: Couple of Roll Cage questions...Safe or Legal?

Spinnetti wrote:

Wow! What a tough crowd! I thought the cage was better than 90% of what I've seen at Lemons including from some folks who are getting paid! (except the huge distance front the front down tube to the cowl... Fold up city!

I agree, but I didn't want to be the first to say it.  I've seen an convertible Alfa with the main hoop butt-welded together to raise it 3" inches, and a 944 with not ONE spreader plate on ANY of the tubes.

Captain
Team Super Westerfield Bros.
'93 Acura Integra - No VTEC Yo!