Topic: Help on Tire Selection?

We are a new team trying to learn the sport of racing very quickly.

Can anyone give me a bit of a crash course in performance tires that could be used for Lemons?  Im trying to research what tires to buy, but I am realizing I dont even know what to start looking for.  I see that I will need a minimum treadwear rating of 190 and they must be DOT approved, but I am still a bit lost at what range I really should be looking for.  I am just looking for enough information so that I can continue research on my own. 

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

2 (edited by slickdizzy 2010-01-25 02:30 PM)

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

Falken Azenis used to be the hot ticket in auto-x. I don't know what we're planning to run on the Audi, but any sticky DOT-approved tire like the Azenis, maybe Hankook RS2 and similar should do the trick.

~Desmond

'90 Audi 200 Quattro (Lemons build)

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

slickdizzy wrote:

Falken Azenis used to be the hot ticket in auto-x. I don't know what we're planning to run on the Audi, but any sticky DOT-approved tire like the Azenis, maybe Hankook RS2 and similar should do the trick.

We are running Nitto Neogens, and like them. We have run 2 races on this set, and will run another before we replace them. We ended up snagging another once-raced set for our other car from a team with deeper pockets...

Team Lost in the Dark
Winner " I got screwed" and "Jay's dream car"
2012 Gulf region champs

4 (edited by bob-e 2010-01-25 02:51 PM)

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

azenis have always worked well for us.  cheap, decent traction for a street tire and seem to last a long time.  what size are you looking for and how heavy is your car?  awd/fwd/rwd?

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

The current hot tire is the Falken Azenis RT-615.  They are cheap and work pretty well.  The old favorite was the Hankook RS-2, but they are no longer available new.  Check Discount Tire Online and Tire Rack to see what is available in your size.  If your car is the 1992 TBird as your name suggests, put that car in the search.  Don't be afraid to play with sizes.  Try lower profile or a bit wider.  A smaller diameter tire will give you shorter gearing and they will be lighter to boot.

BRE Datsun (Broke Racing Effluence) formerly Dawn of the Zed Racing
'74 260Z
Facebook page http://www.facebook.com/editpicture.php … 2559430584

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

The rt-615k is supposed to come out this year ... it may be better than the original rt-615. the press release says they'll still be 200 treadwear, which keeps em in the Lemons candidacy (while most high perf street tires have gone lower, but still above 140 for STS autox rules).

To finish first, first you must finish. -Rick Mears
Pandamonium Racing

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

Don't forget about Direzza Star Specs... they are fantastic.

Summer's Eve Racing - '09 Yee-Haw; '10 Gator-O-Rama, NorDal Hooptie, Yee-Haw; '11 Gator-O-Rama, NorDal Hooptie (Winner, Class A!)
TARP Racing - '11 Yee-Haw, Heaps; '12 Gator-O-Rama (Winner, Class C ... Looking for a Class B Win to Complete the Trifecta!), Heaps; '13 NorDal Hooptie, Gator-O-Rama

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

First go to TireRack.com, put the tire size you have and check reviews and prices on tires they have, they dont have the Falkens though.  We bought a set of 245/45/17 Hancooks that we also got shaved for racing at around $90 a tire at TireRack, they were a clearance item. 

Tires are important - don't scimp, also 14"/15" don't have a lot of choices, 16" are better, 17" is probably the best for price-to-performance ratio 18" or larger get costly. So investigate if you can use taller and wider wheels on your car. The combined Wheel/Tire WEIGHT makes a difference too.  All that unsprung weight effects handling.

Hate to throw so much at ya, but since tires/wheels are an "open" mod. might as well get as much bang for the buck as you can without going crazy overborard.  We bought clearance tires and found a set of rims on Craigslist. We went with the original rims on the car with a set of the best used tires I could find for practice and our "rain" tires and then another "race" set of brand new shaved-for-racing tires on some light wheels.

were you planning on having 4-6 or 8 tires?

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

Falken Azenis are very popular and quite good.....I run the dunlop direeza star spec Z1's (long I know)....and am VERY happy with them....predictable handling for hours on end with no overheating slipperiness that can happen when street tires are pushed too hard....good treadlife too.....the after two test days and 11 hours of racing the fronts still look great and 1 rear is about 50%..but its the inside wheel that the open diff spins more too....

As a rule bring at least 6 mounted tires ready to go.....I needed 5....for my 1st race

Richard Doty
1984 Porsche 928 "Estate"
Porsche- "there is A substitute" Racing
Dirt Poorsche Racing #2

10 (edited by gsmith2424 2010-01-25 06:44 PM)

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

tbird1992 wrote:

We are a new team trying to learn the sport of racing very quickly.

Can anyone give me a bit of a crash course in performance tires that could be used for Lemons?  Im trying to research what tires to buy, but I am realizing I dont even know what to start looking for.  I see that I will need a minimum treadwear rating of 190 and they must be DOT approved, but I am still a bit lost at what range I really should be looking for.  I am just looking for enough information so that I can continue research on my own. 

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

First question is what car are you running, as knowing this will help narrow the tire selection down some.

I have ran a Miata on BFG's with a 340 treadwear rating (about $85-$90 each). These are a perfect tire for a Miata as we have been able to get over 2 races out of one set of tires. These tires work good and have out run alot of people on softer tires that we race against on other Miata's.


Added: Until middle of April discounttiredirect.com has a $80 rebate on Falken RT-615 and also if you find a lower price on them they will match it. This is a website only deal.

11 (edited by Serj 2010-01-26 12:04 AM)

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

I highly recommend at least 16x8s. and I also reccomend hitting tire rack and reading reviews. if you're running a ford, then you can find some 17" mustang knock-offs or stockers that were craigslisted very easily, then just put something that's sticky and has decent wear. We've been running Goodyears for several races now and they have a great balance between the three big factors.

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

We ran Toyo PX4's (225/50's), 300 treadwear.  If you can only afford 1 set of tires I'd recommend them.  Just rotate 'em after the first day.

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

Thank you everyone for your help.

And yes, we are running a 1992 ford thunderbird with rear wheel drive.

Also, we do intend on purchasing and mounting 6 tires for the race.

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

I highly recommend round tires.  Flat spotted ones are kinda bumpy.

More seriously, I have been spending a lot of time trying to decide what tires we will buy for our future replacements.

We have been racing on 225/40r14 Toyo T1Rs.  They are short and fat and reasonably grippy.  They are discontinued and while I can still find some, they are going to be old-new tires.

As ifb_mole pointed out, your wheel size will affect your options.  I currently have 14" or 15" wheels so the options are pretty limited and if they have a tire for that wheel, it will typically only be 1 size.

I have some adapters and 17" wheels I can run now but I am working on a 5 lug conversion without adapters.  You start getting better tire options once you get up to 16" wheels but 17" seems to be a good sweet spot.  Some performance tires start with 17" so you get way more options.

Falken Azenis are pretty much a staple tire in Lemons.  They have mixed reviews.  They have reformulated the rubber for 2010 and the new compounds will be RT-615K.  I am not sure when they will be available.

The Hankook RS2 has been very popular but is discontinued.

The Dunlop Star Spec Z1 is probably the grippiest tires we can run.  No personal experience though.  I've had mixed reviews on that tire too.

The reality is we are racing on street tires.  Many tires will perform well if you do not overheat the tires.  I am trying to come up with a solution to keep the tires cool.  I am thinking a bigger tire, probably shaved, will stay cooler and therefore perform better and last longer.

I spent a good while on the phone with a guy at Tirerack last week.  He discouraged the Star Spec.  They have many knowledgeable people there that can probably offer you some good advice.

Troy

#35 LRE
1973 Datsun 240Z

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

I hereby declare that the "what tire" discussion has surpassed the "kill switch" discussion in terms of enough-already. I realize this is the Newcomers' forum, but even the newcomers have access to the search tool. There are only about 3 or 4 different opinions on this topic anyway, so any search on the topic will come up with those answers. IMHO, YMMV, etc.

Pat Mulry, TARP Racing #67

Mandatory disclaimer: all opinions expressed are mine alone & not those of 24HOL, its mgmt, sponsors, etc.

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

does this forum do "sticky" threads?  or maybe a FAQ for tires, kill switch and what does $500 mean

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

bob-e wrote:

does this forum do "sticky" threads?  or maybe a FAQ for tires, kill switch and what does $500 mean

That's a good idea, Bob. Nick, you lurking?

Pat Mulry, TARP Racing #67

Mandatory disclaimer: all opinions expressed are mine alone & not those of 24HOL, its mgmt, sponsors, etc.

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

Serj wrote:

I highly recommend at least 16x8s. and I also reccomend hitting tire rack and reading reviews. if you're running a ford, then you can find some 17" mustang knock-offs or stockers that were craigslisted very easily

Unfortunately his year T-bird has an oddball 5x108 which limits cheap wheel selection quite a bit. The only Fords that used this pattern were the Tbird/Cougar, Taurus/Sable, and Windstar vans. Not exactly performance oriented options.
The Super Coupes came with 16x7s, so they'd be decent.

AFAIK only some Volvos shared the pattern, and the V8olvo team had trouble finding cheap wide wheels in that pattern so they made their own!

The Homer: Powerful like a gorilla, yet soft and yielding like a Nerf ball.

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

My research led me to the Falkens. In addition,

"Between October 27th and April 30th, 2010, receive an $80 Mail-in Rebate when you purchase a set of four Falken Azenis RT-615 tires"

The rebate can be found here:

http://www.discounttiredirect.com/direc … o?pgid=254

Paul, aka BuFord Hogswaller:  Team Captain, Team Bavarian Ranchero and Team Pink Lloyd

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

LTDScott wrote:
Serj wrote:

I highly recommend at least 16x8s. and I also reccomend hitting tire rack and reading reviews. if you're running a ford, then you can find some 17" mustang knock-offs or stockers that were craigslisted very easily

Unfortunately his year T-bird has an oddball 5x108 which limits cheap wheel selection quite a bit. The only Fords that used this pattern were the Tbird/Cougar, Taurus/Sable, and Windstar vans. Not exactly performance oriented options.
The Super Coupes came with 16x7s, so they'd be decent.

AFAIK only some Volvos shared the pattern, and the V8olvo team had trouble finding cheap wide wheels in that pattern so they made their own!

damn scott, that would suck. see, the way it worked out for us is that i had an 03 Maxima that was totalled on the way home from Flatrock/detroit 07. i rescued the gram lights that sat in my garage for almost a year, and as it turned out, my dad picked up a 98 CVPI. found out that both shared the 5x114/114.3 pattern, pulled them out of storage with the Eagle F1 All-seasons on them, and went to town. they did awesome, and we stuck to those tires on those wheels until there was some apparent nonsense with tire wear and Tirerack put a freeze on new shipments/deliveries. We started grabbing the Eagle GTs in the UHPAS segment and had fun at nelson ledges, only needing one set for the entire race.

21 (edited by rocketresto 2010-01-27 02:52 PM)

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

We use the Dunlop Star Spec Z1 and love them.  Good "heavy" car tire.  We run 245/45/17's on 17 inch steel cragar rims.  We would like to find some lighter rims since they are 60-70 pounds a piece with tires but they are tough rims.  Want to see if I can make some Mustang rims fit over our brakes since the Mustang uses the Mopar 4 by 4.5 bolt pattern.

Team Oly Express
Current car - 1964.5 Plymouth Barracuda, Former car - Size Does Matter 1967 Plymouth Fury
07 IOE Winner Thunderhill, 12 IOE Winner Sears Pointless
https://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/Team- … 4609354407

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

rocketresto wrote:

We use the Dunlop Star Spec Z1 and love them.  Good "heavy" car tire.  We run 245/45/17's on 17 inch steel cragar rims.  We would like to find some lighter rims since they are 60-70 pounds a piece with tires but they are tough rims.  Want to see if I can make some Mustang rims fit over our brakes since the Mustang uses the Mopar 4 by 4.5 bolt pattern.

Try diamond wheel.....they make custom steel wheels for around $100 per wheel in any size you want up to 16x9"

http://www.diamondracingwheels.com/

they won't make bigger than 16" since the steel wheels get too heavy...they are just about perfect in 14-15".....

The 928 Estate is fairly heavy....not Fury heavy, but not light either at a racing weight of about 3200lbs with driver and a full tank....  the dunlops do just fine...I see no reason to change now.....

Richard Doty
1984 Porsche 928 "Estate"
Porsche- "there is A substitute" Racing
Dirt Poorsche Racing #2

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

the star specs are awesome.  sticky, handle heat well, and they last forever.

mike - Schumacher Taxi Service
12+-time loser
"Winner" - We Got Screwed, NJMP '11

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

+3 Star Specs handle awesome. Stay the same hour after hour. On a smooth track surface we get 2 races out of a set. Can't say the same about the RT615, after awhile they get greasy, at least with my driving style. 3100lb FWD car.

Re: Help on Tire Selection?

I'd love to make some rims but need to stick with 17's for the tires we run and to clear our massive brakes.  We have a home made front brake set-up with Viper calipers with the stock C-Body rotors.  We had to cut the cragar rims to make them clear.

Team Oly Express
Current car - 1964.5 Plymouth Barracuda, Former car - Size Does Matter 1967 Plymouth Fury
07 IOE Winner Thunderhill, 12 IOE Winner Sears Pointless
https://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/Team- … 4609354407