Topic: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

Then, I began to consider exiting the vehicle in case of an emergency.

I'm looking at building a 2000 Celica GT [rear drums], or, a sedan [one of several].

Exiting through the Celica's vertically narrow window looks slow, and the window sill looks high enough to be an obstacle.

In exiting, is the window relatively unimportant compared to the rest of the racing equipment [seat, cage, belts, etc.]?

Would you rather build swoopy coupe or a standy sedan?

Or is it really vehicle specific?

I have no emotional attachment to any of my candidates...

No particular familiarity with one marque or another, and none of my family and friends do, either.

Any input would be greatly appreciated.

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

You can always cut down the top of the door as some do.  Note that in some cases a combination of swoopy coupe and containment seats make it near impossible to exit.  Just means you need to consider center and window net instead.  A coupe will have longer doors giving more horizontal room but sedan will likely give more vertical room.  Deciding on car based on door aperture probably only comes into play if your drivers are larger (either horizontally or vertically)

1990 RX7 "Mazdarita" 
1994 Jaguar XJ12 (Winner C-Class 2013 Sears Pointless)
1964 Sunbeam Imp (IOE 2013 Sears Pointless)
1980 Rover SD1 (I Got Screwed 2014 Return of Lemonites) (Sold -> Houston.  Gone and forgotten)

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

Having built both, I prefer the coupe. In a coupe the B column is usually in a place that is easier to deal with when building a cage. Within the same model and year the coupe typically has a few more inches at the rear of the floor pan before the pan steps up to the rear seat shelf. Those inches make it easier to install a slider seat that provides more leg room and it provides more options for belt anchors. Again, within the same model and year, head height is typically the same.

The height of the door panel for egress can easily be dealt with as Cheseroo suggests in both the sedan and the coupe. But in the sedan where the B column significantly shortens the door then you pretty much just have to live with it.

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

I say coupe. The doors are longer openings, and if it is narrow, you can cut it down like someone else said. That is what I did for my 92 Celica
https://scontent.fybz2-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/34442908_985364834953855_4433445988039917568_n.jpg?_nc_cat=102&_nc_ht=scontent.fybz2-2.fna&oh=01d4feb88d18d32e4357e909f3d0eac5&oe=5CC3A3ED

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

We prefer sedan since it is easier to access the back of the car

1992 Saturn SL2 (retired) - Elmo's Revenge -  Class B winner, Heroic Fix winner x2
1969 Rover P6B 3500S - Super G-Rover - I.O.E Winner, Class C Winner
1996 Saturn SW2 - Elmo's Revenge

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

Good info, thanks.

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

No matter what car you have or how you build it, a quick egress only comes with PRACTICE!!!  Take the time to do it over and over, your life could depend on it.


Bill

2017 Thompson Motor Speedway #36 Sabrina Duncan Racing...... WTF.........
2016 Thompson Motor Speedway #36 Sabrina Duncan's Revenge, IOE Trophy, 5th Place 'C' Class 1977 Ford Pinto
2009 Stafford Motor Speedway #16 Team Teflon, 11th Place (overall) 1997 Saturn SL2

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

I've built a coupe and a sedan, and while there is a lot of car specific stuff on the matter, I prefer sedans. Having access to behind the seats for adjusting belts, bolting in seats, loading stuff in the car before going to the track, etc is all so damn nice. Egress really comes down to door bar design, seat choice, seat position, and PRACTICE. It can be made to work in any car if you take the time to think through it as you build.

But I'll go one further, wagons >> all.

20+ Time Loser FutilityMotorsport
Turbo Dodge Powered E36 Build
2008 Saab 9-5Aero Wagon
Retired - 1989 Dodge Daytona Shelby 2011-2015 "Lifetime Award for Lack of Achievement" IOE, 3X I got screwed, Organizer's Choice

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

TheEngineer wrote:

I've built a coupe and a sedan, and while there is a lot of car specific stuff on the matter, I prefer sedans. Having access to behind the seats for adjusting belts, bolting in seats, loading stuff in the car before going to the track, etc is all so damn nice. Egress really comes down to door bar design, seat choice, seat position, and PRACTICE. It can be made to work in any car if you take the time to think through it as you build.

But I'll go one further, wagons >> all.

Wagons are great for that.

1992 Saturn SL2 (retired) - Elmo's Revenge -  Class B winner, Heroic Fix winner x2
1969 Rover P6B 3500S - Super G-Rover - I.O.E Winner, Class C Winner
1996 Saturn SW2 - Elmo's Revenge

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

chaase wrote:
TheEngineer wrote:

I've built a coupe and a sedan, and while there is a lot of car specific stuff on the matter, I prefer sedans. Having access to behind the seats for adjusting belts, bolting in seats, loading stuff in the car before going to the track, etc is all so damn nice. Egress really comes down to door bar design, seat choice, seat position, and PRACTICE. It can be made to work in any car if you take the time to think through it as you build.

But I'll go one further, wagons >> all.

Wagons are great for that.

Hell, minivans are even better and take all your gear to the track in the track in them!

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

Wagons are awesome.  Holds tons of crap to take to the track. I don't have a truck so filling up all the gas cans and leaving them in the wagon on the way to the track is extra nice.

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

OnkelUdo wrote:
chaase wrote:
TheEngineer wrote:

I've built a coupe and a sedan, and while there is a lot of car specific stuff on the matter, I prefer sedans. Having access to behind the seats for adjusting belts, bolting in seats, loading stuff in the car before going to the track, etc is all so damn nice. Egress really comes down to door bar design, seat choice, seat position, and PRACTICE. It can be made to work in any car if you take the time to think through it as you build.

But I'll go one further, wagons >> all.

Wagons are great for that.

Hell, minivans are even better and take all your gear to the track in the track in them!

Unless you cut the roof off of them.

Mistake By The Lake Racing (MBTL)
88 Thunderbird "THUNDERBIRDS ARE GO!"
A&D: 2014 Sebrings at Sebring (NSF), 2014 NJMP2 Jurassic Park (SpeedyCop), 2012 Summit Point J30 (PiNuts)

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

Guildenstern wrote:
OnkelUdo wrote:
chaase wrote:

Wagons are great for that.

Hell, minivans are even better and take all your gear to the track in the track in them!

Unless you cut the roof off of them.

That affects long term storage of all your crap in the van (also a bonus) but not transport
.

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

OnkelUdo wrote:
Guildenstern wrote:
OnkelUdo wrote:

Hell, minivans are even better and take all your gear to the track in the track in them!

Unless you cut the roof off of them.

That affects long term storage of all your crap in the van (also a bonus) but not transport
.

Makes it even easier to toss in those rolls of paper towels you forgot

15 (edited by mechimike 2019-01-08 05:36 AM)

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

Wagons, though, mean you either have to use a factory fuel tank or a fully enclosed $$$$ fuel cell.

The Plymford we built was a 4 door sedan. 

https://s3.us-east-2.amazonaws.com/prod.mm.com/uploads/2018/11/16/1542380475_img_20170618_132208_hdr_mmthumb.jpg

Converted into a 2 door...coupe?

https://s3.us-east-2.amazonaws.com/prod.mm.com/uploads/2018/12/04/1543943326_img_20181016_173552_mmthumb.jpg

With the added structure of the cage, you can probably cut off the B pillar to improve ingress/egress.

Tunachuckers: 10 Years of Sucking at Sucking
2008- 2010:  1966 Volvo 122, "Charlie"
2010-present:  1975 Ford LTD Landau...doesn't have a name?
2018:  1951 "Plymford".  Organizer's Choice - CMP Fall 2018 Hurricane Florence reschedule

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

mechimike wrote:

Wagons, though, mean you either have to use a factory fuel tank or a fully enclosed $$$$ fuel cell.

I never got this argument. If I'm putting a fuel cell in my cars, i'm buying a good one because I do not enjoy burning when my circle track special leaks and burns. We bought an ATL sports cell, installed in our wagon with no bulkhead, and we've been good for 2+ years. Before that it was in our hatchback with no bulkhead. Zero regrets on spending that money.

20+ Time Loser FutilityMotorsport
Turbo Dodge Powered E36 Build
2008 Saab 9-5Aero Wagon
Retired - 1989 Dodge Daytona Shelby 2011-2015 "Lifetime Award for Lack of Achievement" IOE, 3X I got screwed, Organizer's Choice

17 (edited by mechimike 2019-01-08 07:07 AM)

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

I would say that a properly installed, LeMons-legal steel cell with rubber bladder and foam in a sedan trunk is roughly the same order of magnitude of safe as a fully-enclosed ATL cell in a wagon/ hatch's open area. 

Anyway, it's not really an argument...simply a statement of the rules. 

"3.H.6 Fuel Bulkhead. The fuel-tank area must be totally separated from the driving compartment. For example, if the fuel tank is in the trunk area, any openings between the trunk and the cockpit must be permanently sealed with bolted, riveted, or welded metal panels. OE fuel tanks that are separate from, and located completely below, the trunk floor or rear cabin floor are acceptable. If the fuel tank can’t be completely separated from the cockpit by metal panels, a metal-encased, FIA-certified fuel cell with all related compliant fittings must be used."

Unfortunately, there is no hard and fast way to quantify how "safe" something is.  At work we use a matrix, ranking events from "highly likely" to "highly remote" on one axis and "highly lethal" to "minimal injury" on the other.  But even that is only an approximation.  Everyone has their own value that they place on safety, and their own life, whether they want to believe it or not.

Tunachuckers: 10 Years of Sucking at Sucking
2008- 2010:  1966 Volvo 122, "Charlie"
2010-present:  1975 Ford LTD Landau...doesn't have a name?
2018:  1951 "Plymford".  Organizer's Choice - CMP Fall 2018 Hurricane Florence reschedule

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

mechimike wrote:

[snip]https://s3.us-east-2.amazonaws.com/prod.mm.com/uploads/2018/12/04/1543943326_img_20181016_173552_mmthumb.jpg

Swoopy! I like it.

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

drag racers all know a 4 door weighs more than a 2 door.   A two-door hatchback, like my 90 Tercel lets you get inside and store stuff, so that is the best choice, and you can remove the hatch to save weight too.

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

Yes because weight is most Lemons teams problem.

Mistake By The Lake Racing (MBTL)
88 Thunderbird "THUNDERBIRDS ARE GO!"
A&D: 2014 Sebrings at Sebring (NSF), 2014 NJMP2 Jurassic Park (SpeedyCop), 2012 Summit Point J30 (PiNuts)

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

Guildenstern wrote:

Yes because weight is most Lemons teams problem.

All Else Being Equal, yes it is...the drivers weigh too much, they need to be trimmed down, Lemons Midget Racing, I smell a theme..or it might be Thyme instead.

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

It’s Lemons, nothing else is equal.

Mistake By The Lake Racing (MBTL)
88 Thunderbird "THUNDERBIRDS ARE GO!"
A&D: 2014 Sebrings at Sebring (NSF), 2014 NJMP2 Jurassic Park (SpeedyCop), 2012 Summit Point J30 (PiNuts)

Re: All else equal, would you rather build a coupe or a sedan?

Build a crew cab, makes working on the transmission and electronics super easy.

https://drive.google.com/uc?id=1nlrxBWXtjuNNTRN_0wttTXcPgmuIPtoP

'18 PNW-Organizer's Choice '17 PNW-IOE '15 PNW-Judge's Choice '14 PNW-Heroic Fix
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