Topic: Save us some headache - Glance at our cage (Pics O Plenty)
Tried to follow the rules but my old principal can attest that I'm not the best at it. Same story different crap can though. Check it over and tell us what you think.
The 24 Hours of Lemons Forums → Lemons Tech → Save us some headache - Glance at our cage (Pics O Plenty)
Tried to follow the rules but my old principal can attest that I'm not the best at it. Same story different crap can though. Check it over and tell us what you think.
Everything looks pretty good.
Can you show a better pic or two of the rear hoop and diagonal.
That looks suspect.
KT
Good simple design, but my god man, who did the welding? Stevie Wonder? It will probably be fine, but those welds look like straight shit. I'm guessing a notcher was not used on any of the tubing and someone just "filled" the gap.....
I'm no cage expert, so I'll leave the opinions to the pros. I will say nice (snicker) choice of car (snicker, snicker). From the original color, I'd guess around a '72? Welcome to hell. It looks like your battery box/firewall was pretty far gone. We had to scrap our first car for unrepairable rot in the RH firewall.
It looks like you got the seat pretty low. Ours is way too high. Otherwise, your design is very similar to ours. We added a diagonal roof bar from the LH A pillar to the RH side of the main hoop. It gave us extra height in the cage.
It's not the best design, nor the best welding... There is a lot of rust.
You may need to add a cross bar in the same plane as the main hoop and diagnal. It's not specifically in the rules, but it's a very good idea. That is the only problem that I can see and it's not a showstopper.
WTF is this?
no way in hell I'd ride in that car with welding like that. I don't mean to offend you, but I do encourage you to replace that tube at bare minimum.
Note on welding: Moar bead does NOT equal a better weld. A lot of those joints scream cold weld, which means little to no penetration, which equals fail.
Looks like a shielding gas or oxy tank in the background...MIG is good but it's easy to get welds with poor penetration, oxy/acy is expensive, but stick welding still works well for me....easy to get penetration and unless working overhead, good control and cheap...these look like arc welds with lots of overlay, maybe concealing slag/voids. Might still be plenty strong, but a gusset or two probably wouldn't hurt...
Everything looks pretty good.
Can you show a better pic or two of the rear hoop and diagonal.
KT
This is the best one I have.
Good simple design, but my god man, who did the welding? Stevie Wonder? It will probably be fine, but those welds look like straight shit. I'm guessing a notcher was not used on any of the tubing and someone just "filled" the gap.....
Well the guy welding took the American mantra that Mo is Betta so after a few pounds of wire that is what you end up with...
I'm no cage expert, so I'll leave the opinions to the pros. I will say nice (snicker) choice of car (snicker, snicker). From the original color, I'd guess around a '72? Welcome to hell. It looks like your battery box/firewall was pretty far gone. We had to scrap our first car for unrepairable rot in the RH firewall.
It looks like you got the seat pretty low. Ours is way too high. Otherwise, your design is very similar to ours. We added a diagonal roof bar from the LH A pillar to the RH side of the main hoop. It gave us extra height in the cage.
HA! I was hoping you would chime in. It is a 73 if I remember correctly. It is a rust bucket to some extent but still a viable chassis. Our floor is actually lowered a few inches. It helped out with some of us bigger guys tremendously.
I have to admit that these are not my welds. I will bring all of this to the attention of the team and get it addressed. I really appreciate the info so please don't hold back if you see something that is suspect. I am headed out of town for the remainder of the week but I can get one of the guys to post a specific pic if you need. Thanks
From the height of the tank in the back, it looks like an 80ft^3 C25. It's not exaclty hobby size, so someone knows what they are doing with a MIG.
The actual weld on that corner doesn't look bad - from the picture, it looks like it penetrated and doesn't look like there is undercutting on the tubes. But there is entirely too much fill. If you are not going to replace the tube, throw a big ass thick gusset with good welds on that corner and hope that tech likes it.
I know that you are already tied into your door and dash bars, but if you were going to replace that tube - you can cut it above the dash bar and sleeve it along the A-pillar. It shouldn't be that hard to replace. Of course getting a 360 weld on the top will require you to cut the roof...
Jim, oxy/acy is fairly cheap. I only pay ~$70 to get both of my big tanks filled. I would NEVER oxy/acy a cage. It is too easy to f-up since you don't have the easy of heat control of a TIG.
Hey huf_arted, email me and we can talk further about the horrible car choice you made. j/k. I have a few questions/suggestions.
Get some rustoleum on that shit ASAP. All of it, bars and welds.
I would paint the hell out of and on all those corners where tubes come together runa 45 gusset on that ugle front one.
No we use a notcher and the cage fit tight. The guy that welded it just thinks more it better.
I think he said he put 7 or 8 passes on some welds with cross stitch.
Weld on a weld just adds weight, we tried to explain but he still does it.
Hopefull it will pass, I don't think I can afford enough grinder wheels to clean that up.
Thanks for the input guys.
Multi pass welds CAN be strong. That's how you have to do anything over about 0.25". You just have to know what you are doing. Anyway - good luck with it.
Just take a peek at any structural steel bridges/refinery stuff. Multi pass welds.
KT
Just take a peek at any structural steel bridges/refinery stuff. Multi pass welds.
Not on pieces of steel properly fitted (no huge gaps) less than 1/8" thick. Muti-pass welds are used for really thick metal like 1/4" and up.
Those welds scare me: as an inspector, all I think when I see welds like that is poor fit and no penetration. I would have to inspect those welds with a mirror and penetrant to be happy with them... Which event are you prepping for?
is that diagonal bar legal? isn't it supposed to go from corner to corner. Also your back stays don't look "as close to 45* as possible. And your your halo and back stays should join the main hoop at the same height, but that might not be that big of a deal.
is that diagonal bar legal? isn't it supposed to go from corner to corner.
NASA allow the bar to be within 12" of the corner and the SCCA allows it to be halfway along the top.
Also your back stays don't look "as close to 45* as possible.
They are close to 45* on the cage. The main hoop is not vertical so it's a little hard to see. The SCCA allows rear stays to be 30*.
And your your halo and back stays should join the main hoop at the same height, but that might not be that big of a deal.
Not a big deal. Having them in the same line is great for force transference - but as long as they are close it still works. I'd start to get concerned when they are getting about 12" away from each other.
Those welds scare me: as an inspector, all I think when I see welds like that is poor fit and no penetration. I would have to inspect those welds with a mirror and penetrant to be happy with them... Which event are you prepping for?
Dallas in June. Will you be one of the guest inspectors/judges? What are our options here? Removal and replace, gusset, grind an re weld cleanly etc... Thanks
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