1 Topic by Deadpool (edited by Deadpool 2010-09-04 11:12 AM)

  • Registered: 2010-09-04
  • Posts: 13

Topic: Looking to build a Lemons car....... would this pass BS

Hey guys, been browsing the forum for the last two weeks to get an idea for Lemons. Our team is looking to do the PBIR race on NYeve and were debating between a few different cars right now. We've been weighing the pros/cons of each ..... but then yesterday someones post got me thinking/searching craigslist. Our main goal is to have a RWD manual tranny car which is fun to drive. We are really excited about this as 1 of our guys has already been in a Lemons race and wouldn't stop raving about how much fun it is.

Someone posted up a link to a 93 740I with the 4.0 V8 for around $1000. I did some searching and found there are MANY 740/540's from $600-$1000. Now per the rules we could sell the interior/lights etc and get that cost under $500. I understand cooling would be an issue and given the $500 budget I doubt we would be able to do much work there without cheating. Selling the auto tranny and picking up a manual is also something we are looking into with all work being done by ourselves.

I read up on black iron racings 540 which got the peoples curse...... but my understanding is that they got it for being overtly aggressive on track....... though it was considered to be cheaty. If we did ours, we wouldn't have the massive loss of body panels getting the weight really low, it would keep the body and be heavy still.

The other cars were looking at are the 944 NA, RX7 NA, and the BMW 325. Regardless of which car we get we plan to do a Storm trooper theme with a flat white car with black accents/wheels and something ridiculous to go with it.

IF we decided to go with the 740/540 from either the late 80's or early 90's......... what could we do to help not get 100+ BS laps or being cursed. What if we ran skinny tires to limit our traction and make it a handful to drive........ stay on stock suspension...... we really want to do this legitimately for $500 and not be viewed as cheats.

  • From: Land Of Subarus, Colorado
  • Registered: 2009-04-30
  • Posts: 9,416

Re: Looking to build a Lemons car....... would this pass BS

We had a 740 at the New England race that got zero penalty laps (and a 750iL that got zero laps at Nelson Ledges), so it is possible. Just make sure you document all the sales of parts off the car (with screen shots of eBay or Craigslist listings, receipts, photos of money changing hands, whatever you can get) and all the stuff you buy for the car. If you manage to get a manual transmission in a 740, we're going to want to see obsessive documentation. Run an E23 7 Series and you'll probably cruise right through BS, especially if you manage to find a gray-market turbo 745i (which can be had for Lemons prices).

We much prefer 7 Series BMWs to 5 Series BMWs, and we prefer both to the other cars on your want list. Avoid E30s, 944s, and RX-7s if you want to avoid ruthless sweating during the BS inspection. You might consider Japanese luxury cars, such as the Q45, Legend, 929, and LS400. We like luxury cars on the race track.

Murilee Martin aka Judge Phil on Facebook
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  • Registered: 2010-09-04
  • Posts: 13

Re: Looking to build a Lemons car....... would this pass BS

Thanks for the quick response! I've read a bunch of your posts and got a feeling that you love seeing a luxury car on track. The 740 is even easier to find than the 5 series, and I plan to have every bolt/ziptie accounted for in our documentation, we really want to do this by the book.

The 929 is a good car too, I actually used to own a 92 in HS..... fun chassis and can be had for cheap. And if we did a 740/540 I think we might handicap ourselves with narrower tires just for the fun of it..... we would def eat up tires at an incredible rate though haha.

  • Mulry
  • Mulry
  • Ayatollah of Rock-n-Rollah
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  • From: Dallas, TX
  • Registered: 2009-05-01
  • Posts: 4,607

Re: Looking to build a Lemons car....... would this pass BS

Do the 740 or the 750 before any of the others. RX7's and 3-series are dime a dozen, and even 944's aren't rare. Luxobarges are always fun to have in the race. And if you keep a lot of the interior, you and most of your team could even drive to/from the race in style and comfort smile

Pat Mulry, TARP Racing #67

Mandatory disclaimer: all opinions expressed are mine alone & not those of 24HOL, its mgmt, sponsors, etc.
  • From: St Louis, MO
  • Registered: 2009-08-06
  • Posts: 1,014

Re: Looking to build a Lemons car....... would this pass BS

You don't have to get a RWD car with a manual to have fun, trust me. Our first two Lemons cars were RWD with autos and our last two have been FWD with 4 speed autos. Our GTP is the lightest, most powerful, fastest, and best handling car we've had to date. So I wouldn't focus on finding just a BMW, there are lots of cars out there that are fun to race and perform well, keep your options open.

Team Final Gear Crew Chief
#138 1997 Pontiac GTP - Supercharged 3800
#42   1999 Ford P71 Crown Vic
  • From: Land Of Subarus, Colorado
  • Registered: 2009-04-30
  • Posts: 9,416

Re: Looking to build a Lemons car....... would this pass BS

If you really need a car that's pretty quick and reliable on the track, get a Saturn SL or SC. They have an excellent Lemons record.

However, we'd much rather see a Mazda 929. We've been bugging teams to run a 929 or a Legend for years now.

Murilee Martin aka Judge Phil on Facebook
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Judge Phil's Lemons posts on Car and Driver
MurileeMartin.com

Judge Phil's Website

  • From: Houston (Spring) Texas
  • Registered: 2010-02-22
  • Posts: 1,624

Re: Looking to build a Lemons car....... would this pass BS

Don't go with skinny tires on a RWD.

You will slide / spin every lap.
Every time you get a wheel off the track, or spin out, you will be flagged and penalized. Four flags, and you will be out for good.

The race will be over for you before transponder checking has finished.

You don't need to handicap yourself unless your name is Andretti. In which case, you can drive a 458 Italia and burst into flames at BS inspection.

Yee-Haw 2010 "Most Heroic Fix" & "I Got Screwed" -2 trophies for 1 lap, but I took checkered on my lap.
Gator-O-Rama 2012 "Organizers Choice" -2 laps 1 trophy, but i still finished ahead of an E30
Yee-Haw 2013 No trophy -26 laps, I think I see a pattern here
Gator-O-Rama 2014 "Waiting for the Last Minute Call from the Governor Award" -who's counting? John

Hoonatic Racing's Website

  • From: Lockport , IL
  • Registered: 2010-08-22
  • Posts: 76

Re: Looking to build a Lemons car....... would this pass BS

If you can prove the $500 limit was met, I see no reason to sweat things. I don't think I bother trying to swap an auto for a stick in a BMW 740, you are going to eat up all your budget, plus it is just a PITA. Find a car with a stick already in it. Maximize your fun.

All great moments start with the phrase "hey man, hold my beer"
http://dumbshitswithabeater.blogspot.com/
  • Registered: 2010-09-04
  • Posts: 13

Re: Looking to build a Lemons car....... would this pass BS

I like how the 740 isn't a common car for Lemons, and yes it will be a bit more of a PITA to do a manual transmission in it..... BUT I've already sourced a couple completely totalled 540's with a stick and the interior intact..... grab it for a couple hundred.....sell our auto tranny and the interior of both cars and now we have a manual 740i for under $500. Plus I think doing something out of the norm with the stick is in the Lemons spirit.

I know regardless of what we get it will be an EPIC amount of fun...... but stick/rwd will make it even more fun smile

Sucks...... I found a 93 740i for $300......and in good condition...... but it's in Hawaii which explains the low price haha.

  • Registered: 2009-05-01
  • Posts: 297

Re: Looking to build a Lemons car....... would this pass BS

The Black Iron Racing 540 just won one of the days at the Chump race in Fontana in July. It has an auto trans that we shift between 3rd and 4th manually. When you start the car you bump it into "snow mode" which allows wheel spin and better authority over selecting gears. It would have been more fun to drive it with a manual, but the auto trans did not limit the laptimes. Most important thing is to smother that thing with tires. It had 275s at every corner and probably could have used more.

Just another crappy BMW and moto-powered MR2: http://www.facebook.com/BlackIronRacing
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  • sergio
  • Lemons Staff Stalker
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  • Registered: 2009-04-30
  • Posts: 1,185

Re: Looking to build a Lemons car....... would this pass BS

gielamonster wrote:

The Black Iron Racing 540 just won one of the days at the Chump race in Fontana in July. It has an auto trans that we shift between 3rd and 4th manually. When you start the car you bump it into "snow mode" which allows wheel spin and better authority over selecting gears. It would have been more fun to drive it with a manual, but the auto trans did not limit the laptimes. Most important thing is to smother that thing with tires. It had 275s at every corner and probably could have used more.

Awesome engine sound in that car guys! And it's faster than fast.

  • Registered: 2009-10-25
  • Posts: 1,993

Re: Looking to build a Lemons car....... would this pass BS

E30's , E36's, 5 series V8's, Miatas, 944, RX7 and even Z's are just too easy to make fast and are quite common....its the quite common that the judges get bored with...  If you choose to run one of these...you better ramp up the theme big time...like the "kill Phil" or ranchero E30's..... 

Bring a 7 series or other listed luxury car and its easier to get in...plus the parts sales of all the whiz bang interior bits can add up quickly....  I made up our entire budget in the 928 with only a few parts sales.....including the $300 replacement engine (got penalized anyway)

Richard Doty
1984 Porsche 928 "Estate"
Porsche- "there is A substitute" Racing
Dirt Poorsche Racing #2
  • Registered: 2010-09-04
  • Posts: 13

Re: Looking to build a Lemons car....... would this pass BS

icemang17 wrote:

E30's , E36's, 5 series V8's, Miatas, 944, RX7 and even Z's are just too easy to make fast and are quite common....its the quite common that the judges get bored with...  If you choose to run one of these...you better ramp up the theme big time...like the "kill Phil" or ranchero E30's..... 

Bring a 7 series or other listed luxury car and its easier to get in...plus the parts sales of all the whiz bang interior bits can add up quickly....  I made up our entire budget in the 928 with only a few parts sales.....including the $300 replacement engine (got penalized anyway)

That's what I like about the 7 series and other Euro cars is that the interior/parts are worth a lot and can get you well under the $500 if you do it right.