The 24 Hours of Lemons Forums → Lemons Newcomers → What about this cage?
This cage is in an Eclipse that used to be raced in SCCA. All the tubing is 1.5" but I don't remember the wall thickness (I will find out again), car weighs about 2400 lbs.
Look forward to the feedback on the intalll to see if I should consider the car. I apologize for the cell phone quality pictures.
http://picasaweb.google.com/11642352422 … directlink
I am not an expert, ( I have built my own cage that passed Lemons tech ) but it seems to be in order to me. Make sure you read the cage rules well and make sure that the main hoop is one continuous piece, and that the A-pillar bars go all the way from the main hoop to the floor in one continuous piece. You should wait for one of the big dogs to chime in, but as long as the tube is the right thickness, it should be good to go.
rear stays can't terminate on the strut bar. could be fixed by just extending it after the bar to the floor.
The harness bar seem to high for that seat. the belts have to be coming in at 0 to 15 degrees below the opening on the seat.
The one pic someone commented that it is 360 weld so that would have to be fixed.
Belts seem to be the thing that is off at this time to me also. You can also wrap the belts around the tubing behind the seat. We do the same thing on our Miata. Just make sure that the belts are wrapped around the tubing the correct number of times.
Yeah, wrap the shoulder harnesses as noted. Fix the 360 degree weld on the main hoop spreader plate as you noted.
I'd send photos to Nick & Jay & the boys on the rear supports. They *might* buy of on it as-is. It looks pretty well done. Or they may suggest a simpler alternative to make it passable, maybe some gussetting or something that wouldn't be as extensive as replacing the whole rear support bar or adding an extension. (which would need approval, itself... that piece is supposed to be of one continuous tube)
Check SCCA's cage specs to see what their minimum spec is for 1.5" tubing on that car.
Add a few new tubes to what is there and you're gonna be good.
New horizontal bar ( lower for belts )
Two new back stays at 45 degree angles to the floor.
Finish the welds on the mounting plates.
KT
Not at all what you're asking but....
You've posted twice now with prebuilt race cars you're looking to buy and run in Lemons.... I just want to make sure you realize that many people (including the judges) may not find a "retired" racer to be the most appealing candidate for Lemons racing.
Not at all what you're asking but....
You've posted twice now with prebuilt race cars you're looking to buy and run in Lemons.... I just want to make sure you realize that many people (including the judges) may not find a "retired" racer to be the most appealing candidate for Lemons racing.
Agreed. I am trying to work through the car buying process with my teammates. They are convinced we can buy an old race car to save the cost of the cage. I am relying on everyone here to help me prove my point that unless we find an ex-Lemons car, any car we buy will need to have cage and other work done. Personally I want to build a car...
If I were going for an Ex-Racer I'd go for the unloved and uniquely Ugly - look for something like the Austin America Team-ing w/Bad Ideas just procured.
Quote from my favorite Roll cage bender when he saw it:
"If I were to set out to make a GT-5 Race Car, this wouldn't be it"
http://forums.24hoursoflemons.com/viewtopic.php?id=7013
That said - there are some eclipsees racing Lemons, so I don't see why an ex-scca showroom crap can or even IT version of same would be an issue.
Just Theme it up, Pink Floyd style.
vizlvr wrote:Not at all what you're asking but....
You've posted twice now with prebuilt race cars you're looking to buy and run in Lemons.... I just want to make sure you realize that many people (including the judges) may not find a "retired" racer to be the most appealing candidate for Lemons racing.
Agreed. I am trying to work through the car buying process with my teammates. They are convinced we can buy an old race car to save the cost of the cage. I am relying on everyone here to help me prove my point that unless we find an ex-Lemons car, any car we buy will need to have cage and other work done. Personally I want to build a car...
Careful. We bought a ex-Lemons car, but still had to re-weld all the cage spreader plates track side and were given a stern talking to about the rear stays (too long and terminating in a pretty stupid place). Just because it passed tech once doesn't mean it passed with flying colors. Everything on the car needs to look clean and professional, and us new guys really don't know what clean and professional looks like (but I'm learning).
You are going to be better off getting your first cage built by someone with experience, rather than relying on your eye to tell good from bad.
Just use a proven Lemons cage builder and you won't have a problem
Does anyone know of a cage builder in Indianapolis that has done Lemons cages?
Buying a car with a good cage in it can be a serious money saver. I bought the CRX with a cage in it for $375. It was an Autopower cage so I knew it was well made, just had to add another door bar since it came with a single bar. The cage passed tech with flying colors.
Use care and you can get a great deal, doing so saved me a ton of money and a ton of time.
mhrir: we're looking to dump our ex-lemons 98 CVPI (Crown Victoria Police Interceptor) the cage needs a Diagonal and the car SHOULD have a real racecar-type seat put into it, but it's a -very- reliable, fairly fast car, currently sitting in storage in Cincinnati. If you want a LOT of seat time and the least amount of prep work, this would be about your best shot.
It's turned 1:06s repeatedly @ CMP (Lemons record is around 58s on that track in a hella-cheatin' mustang) so you could probably shave some weight off it and do even better.
The rear stays need to terminate on a plate and not be in single-sheer on a strut bar. The belts need to be attached to the harness bar, the harness bar height is incorrect for the seat openings and the welds have to be repaired.
Contact me if you have any questions
-John
The rear braces you have were very common during the late 80s and into early 2000 FIA spec cages. Even though they work fine the best thing to do is to run two more tubes down from the cross tube on the same line as the rear braces from the main hoop to some plates welded to the floor so in theory you make one long tube. Current NASA rules on that subject are attached. On the harness bar just add a second brace bellow the current bar to meet the angle needed for that seat.
Pen
15.6.11 Rear Braces
The main hoop must have two (2) braces extending to the rear. The braces shall be
attached as near as possible to the top of the main hoop, and no more than six (6)
inches below the top. The braces must not contain any bends*. There must be at
least 30 degrees between the plane of the main hoop and the plane of the rear braces.
The main hoop rear braces shall be installed to form no more than a one hundred five
(105) degree angle or no less than a seventy-five (75) degree angle with the main hoop
when viewed from the top. The main hoop braces may be mounted at the rear shock
mounts or suspension pickup points (providing that the braces remain in compliance with
all other sections of the CCR). They may go through any rear bulkhead(s) provided the
bulkhead(s) is sealed around the cage braces. *There may be certain exceptions
allowed for cars that cannot possible meet this “no bend” requirement. One exception is
listed [Ref:(15.6.11.A)]. Other exceptions may be made (not guaranteed) if all of the
required bars meet the specifications for a vehicle in the next heavier weight
classification and the alternative design is submitted to the NASA National Office for
special allowance.
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