1 Topic by grover (edited by grover 2011-02-14 02:04 PM)

  • grover
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Topic: IO Port/Autopower Joint Welding

Note - answer from John@Lemons in post #10.....


A couple of questions regarding the joints on an IO Port cage.  I've searched the forums a lot and don't seem to see this exact question.  Sorry if it's already been answered. 

We currently have a bolt-in cage.  We have welded in NASCAR door bars, an additional seatback bar, and a dash bar. 

We were advised to weld up the entire cage at the last race. 

Is it acceptable to weld the circumference of the external sleeves.  They are about 6-8" long and are much longer than 2X the OD of the main cage.  So - they should provide the right strength. 

Also, do we leave the bolts in - or rotate the sleeves 90 degrees and weld the bolt holes too. 

Just double checking.  This is what our professional welder recommended. 

Grover

  • From: San Diego, CA
  • Registered: 2009-04-30
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Re: IO Port/Autopower Joint Welding

I emailed this exact question to John last week and the response I got was, "Leave the sleeves!    butt welds are weak"

He did not address the bolts, but frankly I'd leave them in just for extra peace of mind.

The Homer: Powerful like a gorilla, yet soft and yielding like a Nerf ball.
  • Registered: 2009-05-15
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Re: IO Port/Autopower Joint Welding

What reason were you given for having to weld the cage? Our car also has a modified bolt in cage and we have never been advised that it needed to be welded.

  • grover
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Re: IO Port/Autopower Joint Welding

The inspector just said it had to all be welded up befor the next race.   i just took his word for it.

  • From: San Diego, CA
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Re: IO Port/Autopower Joint Welding

I was not advised ours had to be welded, but I'm taking it upon myself to weld it and make other modifications to make the car safer. Our car/cage is from the Altamont era and we were expecting to throw the car away and move the cage to a different chassis after a couple of races. Obviously that's no longer the case.

The Homer: Powerful like a gorilla, yet soft and yielding like a Nerf ball.
  • From: Columbus, OH
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Re: IO Port/Autopower Joint Welding

Do you guys know if the bolted-to-the-floor thing is still going to be okay?  Or will we need to weld it in?  Mine's still bolted in.  I guess while I'm welding the sleeves, I could go ahead and add some spreaders and weld it in.

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7 Reply by TeamDFL (edited by TeamDFL 2011-02-10 07:27 AM)

  • From: Craphole, NJ
  • Registered: 2009-05-01
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Re: IO Port/Autopower Joint Welding

I don't know if they want the feet of bolt-in cages welded as well.  You should weld in spreader plates even if it is just bolted in.

http://forums.focaljet.com/team-pit-sto … -fail.html
http://jalopnik.com/#!5390934/mustang-c … -tire-wall

Yes, that is a roll bar foot sticking out through the floor.

http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/8584/2ppneae.jpg

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8 Reply by dculberson (edited by dculberson 2011-02-10 08:32 AM)

  • From: Columbus, OH
  • Registered: 2009-05-26
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Re: IO Port/Autopower Joint Welding

I've got spreader plates, just the cage is bolted to them.  But I think you're right, good idea to weld.

I saw that video; terrifying.  But it's clearly not a "cage," but a "roll bar."  It also appears to have had absolutely no floor reinforcement.  Hence the bare tube sticking out and not a plate.  Fortunately the driver was okay, from what I heard.

Edit: Oh, crap, I just noticed that in the higher quality picture, you can see small spreader plates.  Wow.  That was a bad one.  Okay, I'm going to 24" x 24" spreader plates of 1/4" steel.

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  • grover
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Re: IO Port/Autopower Joint Welding

I have 6x6 spreader plates.  Planning to weld the cage to those pads too.  Basically - everything will then be welded - no longer bolt-in.  Just trying to determine if there are any "rules" on exactly how this is done. 

Question pending with John - waiting on reply.....

  • grover
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Re: IO Port/Autopower Joint Welding

Documenting final answer from John for others who are searching the Forums. 

Here is what I proposed for welding the sleeves:
   Professionally weld all sleeves in place
   Professionally weld cage to the floor plates
   Rotate sleeves a bit - and weld bolt holes up (basically - remove all bolts and their holes from the "bolt in cage")


Answer from John:
    Yes, you are doing the right thing should be good.

  • From: San Diego, CA
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Re: IO Port/Autopower Joint Welding

I would think that leaving in the bolts in conjunction with welding the sleeves would be even stronger.

The Homer: Powerful like a gorilla, yet soft and yielding like a Nerf ball.
  • From: Pearland, TX
  • Registered: 2009-11-25
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Re: IO Port/Autopower Joint Welding

Welds should be stronger than the bolts so by rotating the bolt holes you reduce the inevitable weak point created by the hole.

Namco Racing #48 Miata
  • From: Columbia, South Cackalacke
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Re: IO Port/Autopower Joint Welding

About spreader plates: yes the larger the plate the less chance of it punching through the way it did in the Mustang pictured. But there's only so much you can ask of 20 gauge steel. For that reason I prefer to put the spreader plates on top of an existing box section in the car, if that's not possible I put them as close as possible to a rocker or etc, then run the spreader up the rocker panel and tie the bar tubing in with either a short chunk of roll bar tubing or .120 flat steel. The welded corner 'feet' you see in a lot of Miata cages is a real good solution but it takes some head scratching and careful fab to make them work nicely.

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