The 24 Hours of Lemons Forums → Lemons Tech → What suspension repairs are allowed?
I can't find a complete list of suspension parts that fall in the safety category. Our Lemons car needs ball joints, tie rods, rear suspension links, drive shaft coupler (u joints), it also has a broken spring. Can all these items be replaced with out penalty?
I think this falls into the 2 for 1 rule.
For every dollar you spend on such items you need to spend 2 dollars on bribes and swag during BS. I have been told single malt and cuban cigars are the currency of choice.
4.2.1: Beside the items and processes listed in Section 3, the following are considered safety-related and therefore exempt:
* Wheels, tires, wheel bearings, balljoints, and brake components
* Exhaust systems downstream of the header/exhaust manifold (NOTE: Turbos and related components are NOT exempt from the $500 limit. Nice try.)
* Windshields and wipers. (Stock windshields, true Lexan, or circle-track mesh are acceptable; non-Lexan plastic is not acceptable.)
* Driver comfort & information (steering wheel, shifter, gauges, pedals, cool suits, vents, heaters, radio)
* All fuel hoses, fuel fittings, fuel filters, and related mounts
* All fuel-system components upstream of the fuel pump, including tanks/cells, mounts, fillers, vents, etc. (NOTE: Fuel pumps, carburetors, injection pumps, computers, and individual injectors are NOT exempt from the $500 limit.)
The ball joints are exempt. That said, if you paid enough for a car with all that crap broken to have to worry about fixing those issues on-budget, you probably got ripped off.
Does anyone know if tie rod ends (a.k.a. upper ball joints) are included in that, or only the lower ball joints?
Upper and lower ball joints have nothing to do with tie-rod ends. If you have a double-wishbone suspension, you'll have upper ball joints.
I think you could make the stretch of calling a tie-rod end a "ball joint", as it is the same technology. And, Bad Things(tm) would happen if one broke. Just do it.
U-Joints and springs are definitely not exempt items... though if it's a swing-axle car like an old Triumph or a Beetle, you'd be foolish to not replace the drive axle u-joints, and nobody's going to care if you do. Again, Bad Things(tm) could happen. Just do it.
Think of the fuzzy line as the one between you being in control and a catastrophic failure of a regular wear item (ball joint or similar) causing you to be out of control. A broken spring doesn't fit that category. It's just going to cause your car to handle wonky, which is something that you could deal with somewhat safely by driving within whatever limits the car happens to have.
A used spring should be fine as well as tie rods and drive shafts. They shouldn't cost too much.
Thanks for the info. We got the interior gutted yesterday and it's going to get a roll cage put in on Tuesday. We hope we can get it all done for the Capitol Ofense in June. This will be our first of hopefully many more Lemons race.
When we bought our car, the previous, previous owners had changed the shocks and springs. We got zapped at BS because they were umm newish and much better than stock.
Just saying.
Also, ball joints and tie rod ends are not the same part. However, if you feel you must change them, error on the side of safety. It's much better to have to bribe your way out of them or take penalty laps than it is to have to make a phone call saying you are dead due to a fiery crash...
tie rods typically get ignored. fancy drop spindles, shocks of a non-oem color (red, purple, sometimes yellow) and springs of unusual stiffness and/or color (see the shock colors) and other shiny suspension bits specifically designed to improve handling beyond OEM or be easily adjustable will get the scrutiny. That all being said. if you're just throwing some cheap OEM stuff back on to replace the broken, shitty OEM stuff that came on your car, just do it and risk taking the lumps in BS. better to be safe than searching for a loophole in the "Why am I on my Roof?" rule.
Good rule of thumb
"Can this kill me or someone else on track by possibly causing events that may lead to fiery death?"
If the answer is yes, replace it with something to make it safer, but not faster. If you can buy it from your local auto parts store, and it comes in a blue/yellow box with the word "MOOG" on it, OR it can be easily bought from car-part.com its definitely a-okay to do this.
If the answer is no, or the product comes from Summit Racing, Jegs, Speedway, Go Fast Inc etc leave it alone.
Shop around. Upper and lower ball joints for our Jaguar were $70 a piece, and we needed all four. We found a front end rebuild kit with all four ball joints, tie rod ends, control arm bushings, and sway bar bushings for $280. The individual ball joints and the kit were from the same site. Show that to a judge and you might get some leeway. (no guarantees)
I'd go with the ball-joints and control-arm bushing are safety items excuse - as long as you replace with oem style and not Poly or heims etc...
Sway bar bushes are not safety - use a piece of garden hose.
Springs - used. period. not need be from same car...
Shocks. again, used, and from trucks and vans are pretty stiff - but stiff may not be a gain unless you have stiffer springs. Suspension tuning is a science and an art.
or just budget like mad and find good deals on a few cheater parts.
brakes and tires are free and power means little to nothing so why not use the budget on turning well?
I put new struts on the Bird for the last race. With a 300 residual, 106.00 for them was well within budget. That, some seals and gaskets and we were ready for the next race.
Then, the hidden oil cooler hose (stock item on turbo coupes) decided to get a leak. guess what we did with 350 residual?
I always thought of tie rod ends as ball joints, mostly because they are ball joints, but also because they are safety-related ball joints. It's a common failure item that can cause an unsafe condition, which I think is the point of 4.2.1. We replaced one of ours without claiming it, but those are cheap and after our recent collision with the Tunachuckers we're actually under budget based on our residual value. I don't know about next race though, we actually finished a race without blowing up the engine, so our residual may not be as generous next time.
Rather than focusing on bribery as the way to get your car through the BS Inspection, focus on bringing the right car! Ditch the RX-7 and get a Reatta!
Very true. I didn't have to explain anything about the kit costing the same as a set of ball joints. Judge Phil took one look at the stock engine, laughed, and our BS inspection was over.
Seems like if you are there to win on overall laps, it will show, and you will be scrutinized (whether you have bent the rules or not with your cheaty suspension parts). Be prepared with itemized costs, pictures of transactions, notarized documents (joking), etc.
If you are there to try to win IOE or race a "hunk of junk" for fun and see what happens, that will show, and BS inspection will be a breeze. It won't matter if you have new ball joints on your Reatta, as your Reatta is a pile and it will blow up no matter if your whole suspension is made from unobtainium.
We had to replace one tie rod just before our first race, the other one right after, and all four ball joints right after that. We just did it, not wanting to be the team that inspired a new "no-randomly-self-steering cars" rule.
The 24 Hours of Lemons Forums → Lemons Tech → What suspension repairs are allowed?