• Ogers
  • Rookie Driver
  • Offline
  • Registered: 2011-03-07
  • Posts: 2

Topic: Cheaty McCheat Cheat

Hi Y'all

I wanted to ask how the judges would look on a 4CYL with a Turbo. Something like an old Golf or a 1970's BMW 2002.

It won't bother me one little bit if they give me some laps or whatever, I'm never going to win, I just don't want it to get crushed.

I'd get a real kick out of building somethign a little different, and yuo can buy these cr@ppy chinese turbo's on eBay for a few hundered bucks. Mostly it's because I love the challenge of building it on a tiny budget.

Realistically I can see the build costing me $1000, so lets say I pick the car up for $300, can I really swing the judges with some pap story about selling the seats and the stereo for $800? I'm fully prepared to paint the car pink and wear lime green mankini to distract the judges if nescessary.


I really want to get into the spirit of the Lemons, but I also need to fulfill my inner engineer.

2 Reply by firegremlin (edited by firegremlin 2011-03-07 02:23 PM)

  • From: Rockville, MD
  • Registered: 2010-12-15
  • Posts: 1,155

Re: Cheaty McCheat Cheat

You can build a turbo car for FAR less than that.

Example: I have a CT26 turbo off of a Supra that I can't take apart - the outlet elbow is stuck to the turbine housing. Apart from some chips on the compressor wheel and some minor smoking it made on startup, it's good - feed 40 weight oil into it and it'll run fine. You can have it for $50, and I'm sure there are other such things that you can buy for even less. Has a built-in 6psi wastegate.

Mount a suck-through Quadrajet to it (I love Quadrajets!). Should cost you $30 at a junkyard, they're a dime a dozen. A rebuild kit for ~$15 will fix it if it doesn't work out of the box.

I think that's it, the rest is piping (near-free) and fab work (your sweat cost nothing wink ).

Now, if you don't have the tools or skills to adapt such piles of crap to your motor then don't think that brand-new components will do you any better. I know for a fact that our turbo 1.8 will give us plenty of trouble, and it's a friggin all-stock factory motor that supposedly bolts up to stock transmission and mounts. As much as I like an engineering challenge, we only have 2.5 months to do it and even with our limited scope it'll be a stretch.

I think it's a part of the game - anyone can build something with an open budget, but spending countless hours building a completely ghetto system because your budget is $157.56 is the true engineering challenge here.

So go find a cheap pick'n'pull, hit craigslist/ebay, start cutting and soldering and welding and tinkering and eventually you'll have a turbo Golf, 2002, or even a Cadillac Cimarron that's well within the budget. Especially a Cimarron wink

K Car Stalker
  • From: Baltimore, MD
  • Registered: 2010-05-20
  • Posts: 1,745

Re: Cheaty McCheat Cheat

I see nothing wrong with this plan - it sure as hell isn't going to help you win. You can cut down the cost of a turbo build a lot by using things like PVC pipe for your plumbing and a junkyard turbo instead of a shiny new Chinese one. See http://www.motoiq.com/magazine_articles … ealed.aspx for a good example from some absolute legends.

Crushing isn't done by the judges, it's done by the vindictive bastards you're racing against. It's only a serious danger when you're either unrealistically fast or driving consistently like an asshole.

Driver, Pit Monkey, Rod Buster and Engine Fire Starter
Team FinalGear
  • Registered: 2009-05-01
  • Posts: 526

Re: Cheaty McCheat Cheat

Your car probably won't be crushed but if it's really nice and Jay likes it he might claim it.

Team: V-Ram/Altamont Team: Knights of the Round Track/Reno/Buttonwillow/Thunderhill Team: Death Mobile/Sears 2010/Thunderhill/ChumpCar  Spokane/ MSR Houston/Buttonwillow/Sears. MRolla Project /Reno
http://stickfigureracing.blogspot.com/
  • From: St Louis, MO
  • Registered: 2009-08-06
  • Posts: 1,014

Re: Cheaty McCheat Cheat

The judges love any and all cars with forced induction, the more insane and cobbled together the system is the better.

Team Final Gear Crew Chief
#138 1997 Pontiac GTP - Supercharged 3800
#42   1999 Ford P71 Crown Vic
  • Spank
  • Utter Madman
  • Offline
  • From: Escondido, CA
  • Registered: 2009-06-10
  • Posts: 5,864

Re: Cheaty McCheat Cheat

Ogers wrote:

Hi Y'all


I'd get a real kick out of building somethign a little different, and yuo can buy these cr@ppy chinese turbo's on eBay for a few hundered bucks. Mostly it's because I love the challenge of building it on a tiny budget.

Challenge yourself as much as you want: for $500.

Our mini is a 4-kabanger and we're running her turbocharged for the 2011 season. And within the budget limitations, too.

The "spirit" is doing it on the cheap, not on the NEW and cheap.

I picked up a turbo off of a shelby charger 2.2 at the junkyard for under $100. You can do the same or better if you're the engineer you say you are.

Spank's Website

  • From: Land Of Subarus, Colorado
  • Registered: 2009-04-30
  • Posts: 9,416

Re: Cheaty McCheat Cheat

You can do junkyard turbocharging for Lemons prices. It will blow up, but so?

Murilee Martin aka Judge Phil on Facebook
Murilee Martin on Twitter
Judge Phil's Lemons posts on Car and Driver
MurileeMartin.com

Judge Phil's Website

  • jrbe
  • Effluent
  • Offline
  • From: Central CT
  • Registered: 2009-06-23
  • Posts: 921

Re: Cheaty McCheat Cheat

In my opinion a junkyard turbo would be more reliable than the chinese turbos on ebay.  It might look new but that doesnt mean a thing with those.

-Killer B's (as in rally) '84 4000Q 4.2V8. Audis never win?
  • From: Rockville, MD
  • Registered: 2010-12-15
  • Posts: 1,155

Re: Cheaty McCheat Cheat

jrbe wrote:

In my opinion a junkyard turbo would be more reliable than the chinese turbos on ebay.  It might look new but that doesnt mean a thing with those.

Unlike a chinese turbo, it span in some car problem-free for many, many hours, so if it still spins and doesn't smoke, it's better than new because it's time-tested wink

K Car Stalker
  • From: Long Beach, CA
  • Registered: 2009-06-14
  • Posts: 294

Re: Cheaty McCheat Cheat

Agreed.  Get a junkyard turbo.  The build quality is exponentially better than the Chinese eBay turbos.  Speaking as someone who hears about them blowing up constantly, your best and cheapest bet is to get something small off an OE turbo car. 

There's a lot of good advice on getting turbo crap cans to run well on this forum and elsewhere in the dark reaches of the interwebs.

-Kyle
Eyesore Racing
"That's probably wrong, but it's worth a shot."

wrappedinbacon's Website

  • From: Choctaw, Oklahoma
  • Registered: 2009-11-12
  • Posts: 2,145

Re: Cheaty McCheat Cheat

I have yet to see a single turbo at the local Pull-A-Part. They get yanked and sold as soon as they hit the yard.

  • From: Shakopee, MN
  • Registered: 2009-10-05
  • Posts: 136

Re: Cheaty McCheat Cheat

Find a local automotive forum for common factory turboed cars like DSM's or SRT4s. There's always used turbos on there from people upgrading.

  • Registered: 2009-10-25
  • Posts: 1,993

Re: Cheaty McCheat Cheat

GO FOR IT.....if your car is "Lemons" enough.....the budget doesn't matter all that much...in other words if you show up with a turbo E30...your guaranteed lots of laps....regardless of your "story"....however pick something much more horrible to start with like an E21....and use proper junk-yard parts with PVC tubes chances are you will fit in just fine.....

Judges love to see ghetto charged whips....the more outrageous the better.....the more unique the better too.....

Richard Doty
1984 Porsche 928 "Estate"
Porsche- "there is A substitute" Racing
Dirt Poorsche Racing #2
  • Ogers
  • Rookie Driver
  • Offline
  • Registered: 2011-03-07
  • Posts: 2

Re: Cheaty McCheat Cheat

WOW! Awesome respones. Thanks!

A ghetto turbo sounds like way more fun......... it just never occured to me, and as several people pointed out it won't require too much cheating!!!


Now does anybody know where I can get a fire retardent mankini?.......

  • From: Gilbertsville, PA
  • Registered: 2009-12-22
  • Posts: 3,251

Re: Cheaty McCheat Cheat

We bought a car w/ a turbo already in it.

When it blows up, V8 baby!

Silent But Deadly Racing-  Ricky Bobby's Laughing Clown Malt Liquor Thunderbird , Datsun 510, 87 Mustang (The Race Team Formerly Known as Prince), 72 Pinto Squire waggy, Parnelli Jones 67 Galaxie, Turbo Coupe Surf wagon.(The Surfin Bird), Squatting Dogs In Tracksuits,  Space Pants!  Roy Fuckin Kent and The tribute to a tribute to a tribute THUNDERBIRD/ SUNDAHBADOH!
  • From: Rockville, MD
  • Registered: 2010-12-15
  • Posts: 1,155

Re: Cheaty McCheat Cheat

Remember, you get away scott-free at BS when you show up with a Sentra SE-R and a turbo Iron Duke and/or working 8-6-4 Cadillac wink

K Car Stalker
  • From: Sacramento
  • Registered: 2010-08-09
  • Posts: 1,665

Re: Cheaty McCheat Cheat

The uber reliable VW Turbo Beetle guys say. hmm.
$1000? we probably own that in spares. What's on the car is probably worth $600-$750, depending on how bad your math is - and on which set of spare are currently residing on same. (The reason it doesn't go lower than that is the body was purchased with too much crap that isn't on the car and a lot of it didn't sell at the swap meet - but the totals on the spread sheet are still the totals)

As for Like?
It got a nice write-up on Murilee martin and TTAC (mostly the same write-up)
Somewhere in the write it was mentioned "if all this stuff showed up on an e-30 we'd be scrutinizing receipts, but as it is on a type 3 A/C engine in a bug there was no questions".
~as Spank says, "in the Spirit of Lemons" - that's how it is built (and being re-built, it proved to be very reliable. As in as reliably predictable in blowing up)

~so yeah - that's what they look for - ingenuity and craptitude, with the spirit of $500.
Avoid BMW products unless it looks like an Isetta. Go for an Audi Fox instead.

...turbo's - one of mine came with the $200 engine that blew up. the other FOUR I got for $55 for a pair of a 300ZX (one frozen) and $22 for a pair off of a JDM Subaru that wouldn't work for USM a guy couldn't use. One was Craigslist and the other was just chatting 'bout Lemons with a parts counterman.

Go for it! What could possibly go wrong?

  • Registered: 2011-02-26
  • Posts: 22

Re: Cheaty McCheat Cheat

A used turbo from an unpopular application should be as cheap or cheaper than a good used alternator.  Stock ICs are almost as cheap, or you can build your own water injection cheap too.  I say go for it.  I wouldn't feel cheated if someone showed up with junkyard fabbed turbo and survived the race with t.