The 24 Hours of Lemons Forums → Lemons Tech → Roll Cage W/O Passenger Side Door Bar
I've heard some stories and see pictures of some awful stuff. I guess the cost of equipment really eats into what people can put into the car. Maybe its the local shops, but we moved the car 400 miles each way to have a cage put in.
Tech just can't make up rules as they go along. Unless there are other problems with a cage, they can't just make you add bars that are not mandated by the rules.
You're right, of course. But one man's "make up rules" is another man's "interpretation" of the rules. This happens in any situation where one man is empowered to cast deciding judgment on the work of another man, not just Lemons tech. Like Murilee said in another thread, it's all subjective.
Those dual driver's door bars may comply with the letter of the rules, but I don't think that they quite meet the spirit of the rules.
Think about all the different cars out on the track, some low, some a bit higher. The drivers bars are great if the bumpers from all the other cars out there are at that height, but that's probably not the case. You should seriously think about a third bar on the drivers side that is up closer to the window opening to prevent something from jumping up and over the two bars, and hitting the driver in the shoulder area.
The #78 HondAcura does not have a passenger side bar, but we have thought about adding one, after getting t-boned at the March race (Infineon). Pushed the passenger door in about 8-10".
djcommie wrote:That is the most skin-of-the-teeth cage I have ever seen. I wouldn't race in it.
You should have seen some of the cages that passed during the 2007-2008 season.
His cage is the Cadillac of cages compared to some of those. Although I do agree that it is very minimalist it will pass the requirements of the Roll cage 3.1 Ruling.
Just watch the video on the Lemons home page...
It shows removed top, a-pillars and windshield gone, too, and only a b-pillar roll bar. Safety third!
I would not drive inside that cage. With all the different sizes and weights of cars out there, it's just not worth the chance.
I agree that the cage meets every requirement to pass tech but as others have said, I wouldn't race that car on a dare. At the very least, put in a diagonal from the main hoop, just above the door handle, down to the base of the front down tube.
Is anyone doing more than the minimum rules? For instance, putting a horizontal bar in between the backstays? Or another half diagonal in the main hoop going from the horizonal bar down to the base? At 1.5-1.8 lbs. per foot, the extra 25-30 lbs. of tubing in my cage means nothing when compared to the trade-off in safety.
I guess time is a big factor....I'd rather race in a minimal cage sitting on big spreaders with strong 360 degree welds than a birdcage that's slapped together. I guess both is best..I've seen some circle track Enduro rules that allow a section of hot rolled channel externally bolted across the driver's door for extra insurance....might be a cheap solution if allowed. Mount with carriage bolts and fender washers and it should be no problem...
So to wrap-up this thread and put a bow on it.....
The pics show a cage that is the bare minimum that's going to have any chance at passing tech.
Some people would race in it, others not.
There's a better than 50/50 chance that a passenger side door bar and a dash bar will be add before the Sept. MSRH race, and 100% chance before the following race.
The roll cage rules, with the "Professionally made full roll cage required" wild card statement causes some teams to question whether they are going to pass tech or not. Maybe that's the purpose and why they start the rules that way. Like a wild card, that requirement can be just about anything the tech judge wants it to be......it's good to be the King.
See ya at MSRH Sept. 10th, I'm praying for a dry weekend.
The roll cage rules, with the "Professionally made full roll cage required" wild card statement causes some teams to question whether they are going to pass tech or not. Maybe that's the purpose and why they start the rules that way. Like a wild card, that requirement can be just about anything the tech judge wants it to be......it's good to be the King.
This has zero to do with being a "king." The tech inspectors are there to keep your ass as safe as feasable and to give you a better than average chance of walking away from an accident.
"Professionally made" is to keep some yahoo from trying to make a cage in his backyard - Yes, I saw this exact thing at multiple races. It's trying to stop someone from borrowing a welder from their brother in law, picking up some second hand rusty tubing from a salvage yard, and trying to bend their tubing with a $80 Harbor Freight pipe bender. That isn't going to be a good cage, especially if they've only ever seen cages over the internet. That cage will not have a good design or good welds. It won't have the tubing notched correctly or good spreader plates. How do I know? I had to tech this shit and tell teams that they had to fix it or not race. At one point, I was trying to explain to one team what a main hoop diagonal was and had to go to three different cars in line at tech before I found one that was correct.
For the record here is a text book example of a high quality e30 cage, note the dual foot protect bars that go to the front wheel wells and how the plate also goes vertical onto the rocker where the strength is
I prefer nascar style door bars but the customer requested x bars to retain the power windows
The 24 Hours of Lemons Forums → Lemons Tech → Roll Cage W/O Passenger Side Door Bar
